Why is Madhu Pandit attacking Prabhupadanuga-
devotees of Hare Krishna Community (HKC), Jaipur, India?
Madhu Pandit – Why are you creating problems for the HKC Jaipur devotees?
Why are your Akshaya Patra (AP) people attacking
Dayalu Nitai of Hare Krishna Community Jaipur?
(this is JAIPUR STRUGGLE FOR TRUTH part I,
article is continued in Part II: JAIPUR STRUGGLE FOR TRUTH – II)
(April 29th, 2014)
Not long ago you were “Struggling for Truth” complaining that ISKCON is attacking your Bangalore Hare Krishna Centre. So, now why are your Akshaya Patra people doing the same with devotees of Hare Krishna Community, Jaipur? Please stop your attacks. We are on the same side and there is NO NEED of attacking our devotees.
Your Akshaya Patra devotees are engaged in false and malicious propaganda against the devotees of the Hare Krishna Community Jaipur. You have to stop this!
Dayalu Nitai Prabhu has been complaining about this to you with a copy to all your GBC members since last 3-4 years but nobody has cared to do anything to stop this malicious propaganda that HKC, Jaipur is bogus because it is not under ‘your’ GBC.
Your devotees are going to the extent of telling people not to give donation to HKC, telling the students not to attend lectures organized by Dayalu Nitai, spreading false stories that Dayalu Nitai asked for some post so he was removed from Akshaya Patra wherein the fact is that he has been preaching in Jaipur since the year 2000 when Akshay Patra did not even exist!!!
Now you are discussing so many compromises with ISKCON, Why are you not able to properly communicate with us ? Instead of trying to find a peaceful solution you are using words like “full scale war” for trivial issues in your mails to Dayalu Nitai Prabhu.
We suggest that you or your representative should meet with Dayalu Nitai Prabhu as soon as possible and clear all differences and misunderstandings and undo all the damage that has been done by Akshay Patra devotees. Don’t let this fighting destroy the faith of devotees who are trying to become faithful followers of Srila Prabhupada.
Dear Madhu Pandit and Chanchalpati Prabhus, your continued false propaganda against us has to stop. Otherwise we will be forced to take appropriate steps to protect Srila Prabhupada’s movement going on here in Jaipur by HKC devotees.
If you still do not take any action then we will assume that you do not care for any other Prabhupada-anuga group of devotees which are not controlled by “YOUR” organization. In that case you should stop calling Iskcon Bangalore as Srila Prabhupada’s Iskcon. Since you are antagonistic against Srila Prabhupadas Ritvik temple in Jaipur we will be forced to believe that you and your AP has nothing to do with Srila Prabhupada’s real mission. Your so-called fighting for the RITVIK CAUSE is nothing but a farce.
To substantiate all the above claims we have included the link “Open letter to Madhu Pandit Das and Chanchalpati Das from Dayalu Nitai Das”
If you care to hear other devotees who are not part of your group then We can also discuss about so many visible deviatons in the working of IB group of temples from the teachings of Srila Prabhupada. If you still do not respond then for everyones benefit we will bring out all these deviations from Srila Prabhupada’s teachings with strong proofs and evidences in our next article.
“Satyam, truthfulness, means that facts should be presented as they are for the benefit of others. Facts should not be misrepresented. According to social conventions, it is said that one can speak the truth only when it is palatable to others. But that is not truthfulness. The truth should be spoken in a straight and forward way, so that others will understand actually what the facts are.” (Bhagavad-gita 10.4 purport)
Open letter to Madhu Pandit Das and Chanchalpati Das from Dayalu Nitai Das
From: Dayalu Nitai Das dayalunitai108@gmail.com
Date: Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 12:01 AM
To: Chanchal Pati Das cpd@iskconbangalore.org
Cc: Madhu Pandit Das <mpd@iskconbangalore.org>,Ratnagada <rgovindasa@yahoo.com>,
===================================================================
For the convenience of all the devotees who are reading this letter I will use the word HKC to refer to Hare Krishna Community, Jaipur and AP to refer to Akshayapatra, Jaipur and I will use MPP to refer to Madhupandit Prabhu in all further references in this letter.
For the information of all those devotees who may not know about HKC, I will give a brief history of HKC before coming to the main points. I have been preaching the teachings of Srila Prabhupada since the year 2000, much before AP came to Jaipur. I started preaching under the banner of HKC from 2003. Finally HKC was formally registered as a Non Profitable Trust (order no- 24/3-09-10/2009-10/48) in May 2008. HKC has also got income tax exemption from the government under the clause 80(G).
The trust deed of HKC was executed strictly according to the Direction of management (DOM) which was given by Srila Prabhupada as the final document to manage his society ISKCON. According to the trust deed there are elections every 3 years wherein general members of the trust vote and the President, treasurer and secretary are re-elected. These general members are full time dedicated initiated disciples of Srila Prabhupada with a good track record of at least five years. HKC is dedicated to fulfil the same aims for which Srila Prabhupada founded Iskcon.
Initiation is performed as per the ritvik system as given by Srila Prabhupada in July 9th letter. I, as the current Temple President of HKC recommend devotees for 1st and 2nd initiations to some ritvik. Some senior disciples of Srila Prabhupada like Gauridas Pandit Prabhu (personal servant of Srila Prabhupada during his final pastimes) have played the part of ritvik in the initiation ceremonies conducted here. In the absence of a globally accepted GBC this is the best use of a bad bargain in order to strengthen the faith of devotees in Srila Prabhupada. At present there are 23 full time dedicated brahamcaris (mostly from reputed Engg. and Mgmt. colleges), 3 full time dedicated grihasthas, one brahamcari preparing for sannyasa, 15 gurukul students, 100 cows in our go-shala, 100 bigha land where development of “Hare Krishna Village” is going on in full swing.
There are many hostels where hundreds of boys are living in a Krishna Conscious atmosphere, worshipping Srila Prabhupada as their spiritual master, reading his books, hearing his lectures etc. There are preaching programs going on in almost all colleges. HKC has also started another centre in Uttranchal which will also serve as the destination for gurukul boys in summers. Uttranchal is in Himalayas and therefore the weather is pleasant there when it becomes very hot in summers in Jaipur. HKC is also going to start a new centre in Jodhpur very soon.
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Dear Chanchal Pati Prabhu,
Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
I hope this letter finds you in high Krishna Conscious spirit and good health.
You must be aware of all the incidents which are happening in Jaipur since last 5 years as I have been marking a copy of all the mails which were exchanged between me and MPP regarding AP Jaipur devotees calling our group (HKC) bogus, telling the donors not to give donation to HKC, telling the students not to associate with HKC devotees as they are not bonafide, telling people that ritvik initiation of HKC devotees is unauthorized, telling people some false stories about me that I demanded some post so I was removed from AP etc. etc.
I have been complaining about this non-vaisanava behavior to MPP with a copy to you, Amitasana Prabhu and Ratnagada Prabhu (President of AP, Jaipur) but nobody cared to do anything to stop this unpleasant, false and malicious propaganda. Once around 3 years back I even talked to Ratnagada about it and he told me that better we maintain distance and not intermingle.
Unfortunately AP devotees have been acting duplicitly by telling us that you do your preaching and we are doing our preaching but behind our back continuing to propagate above mentioned malicious things. In spite of all this there has not been a single incident wherein myself, any of our full time devotees or even hostel boys have spoken anything against AP.
Many times our devotees raised these issues with AP Jaipur devotees but they would deny all these charges saying that they have not done anything like that. So I have collected the following proofs to substantiate my claims –
1. Recording of phone calls of senior AP Jaipur devotees directly telling students not to associate with HKC devotees because we are bogus, not bonafide etc.
2. SMS sent to students from mobile phones of senior AP Jaipur devotees including their Vice President Anantasesha Das that HKC is bogus.
3. List of many donors who are ready to vouch that AP Jaipur devotees told them not to give donation to HKC as we are bogus etc.
4.List of many students who are ready to vouch that they were told some false stories about me that I was removed from AP because I demanded some post, so I started my own organization.
If you remember how much I fought against Iskcon to establish AP in Jaipur and when AP finally
started their centre here, Nimai Pandit Prabhu raised this issue repeatedly in Iskocn Bangalore GBC meetings to recognize HKC as an authorized Prabhupadanuga center. In response to that Iskcon Bangalore GBC gave a proposal to me through Nimai Pandit that 2 centres in one city will create problems later on so I should close HKC and move to Jodhpur and take care of AP and FOLK preaching there. This happened in 2009. I had replied to Iskcon Bangalore GBC though Nimai Pandit that if the 2 temple presidents sign a memorandum of understanding then we can co-exist peacefully. And still if all the devotees feel that there should be only one centre then instead of me going to Jodhpur, let Ratnagada go out of Jaipur and I will take care of Jaipur.
At this point I had given many reasons why it is not a good idea to ask me to move out of Jaipur as Krishna is utilizing my I.I.T degree, my being a local person from Jaipur etc. nicely for preaching. I had also stated that if Ratnagada is not inspired to go to Jodhpur then you can send him to a bigger city like Delhi and Jodhpur can be taken care of by Abhimanyu who is already preaching there. I had also mentioned in this letter that I do not need any organization‟s name for preaching as I am already getting good success in preaching in my current profile.
The AP Jaipur devotees are misutilizing this letter by showing some parts of this letter to the students and trying to twist the facts in order to prove that I was demanding some post etc. I am attaching that letter which was sent to Nimai Pandit and was forwarded by Nimai to all the members of Iskcon Bangalore GBC as a file “DND mail to NPD (Dec. 2009)” for everyone‟s detailed reference.
The purpose of writing this mail to you is to try for the last time to hold a meeting between Ratnagada, myself and some other senior devotees like you. I am sending this proposal to Ratnagada also. But seeing the seriousness of the situation and the distrust created here your presence in the meeting is essential so that some peaceful solution can be arrived at. Seeing the past record I am not very hopeful for a reply, still I am trying for the last time on the request of our mutual friend Nimai Nitai Prabhu of Ukarine. May be it will appeal to you that this meeting may prevent 1) so many offences against devotees, 2) causing faithlessness amongst general people towards Srila Prabhupada and Krishna, 3) children of grihasthas being deprived of studying in a Prabhupadanuga Gurukula etc.
AP Jaipur devotees are branding everyone other than themselves as bogus. They had put up a list of organizations in Jaipur which are bogus in AP‟s estimation in which the name of HKC and another organization GIVE was also included. I have a photograph of this notice which is now removed from their notice boards. GIVE is being run by a very senior devotee Vrindavan Chandra Prabhu who has disassociated himself from Iskcon and agrees with the 9th July letter. What about Hare Krishna Society, Prabhupada Sankirtan Society which are being run by senior Prabhupadanuga devotees ? Are they all bogus?
The worst thing which this false propaganda by AP can do is to deprive many children from getting trained in a nice Prabhupadanuga gurukul running strictly according to Srila Prabhupada‟s instructions since many parents will be put off.
If still we do not sit and talk then these things will increase. This I have been mentioning in all my previous mails from last so many years. You can see the attached file “DND mail to MPD (May 2010)” which was written to MPP 3-4 years back. I am reproducing the following few lines from this mail to MPP which was sent to him 3 years back on 7th May 2010 to substantiate my claims –
“I wanted to bring to your notice about some unpleasant propaganda being done by some of the devotees in Akshaya Patra, Jaipur. In reference to your discussion with Nimai Pandit Prabhu in a meeting of ISKCON inc. trustees in Bangalore around six months back about 2 Temple President’s operating in one city, I would like to bring to your notice that the conflicts have started increasing and if you do not take some action it will have a increasing negative effect on Srila Prabhupada’s preaching mission in Rajasthan and will drive away many sincere souls from the lotus feet of Srila Prabhupada. “
And still if Ratnagada, yourself or MPP do not reply then I will be forced to believe that AP has nothing to do with Srila Prabhupada‟s mission and fighting for the ritvik cause is a farce.
I have always respected you and MPP as senior Vaisnavas. MPP‟s last mail to me was very confusing in which he was saying that he is secular under the AP brand and cannot appreciate Hare Krishna Village and he wears 2 hats one of AP under which he is secular and thus cannot talk of religion and other is Iskcon under which he can talk of Krishna.
So in the last few days I was trying to get some information about AP, ISKCON, High court case etc. to know the truth. Normally I do not visit internet much, though Raghav Pandit who is secretary of HKC informs me of necessary things which require my attention. But this time I was going through the internet and found some shocking truths which were also confirmed by many devotees. Some of those truths are as follows:
1) High court has given a judgement against MPP for forging papers and cheating. I knew that there is some case going on between Iskcon Bangalore and Iskcon Mumbai but I did not know about this forgery. I do not how far it is justified to forge documents in the name of serving Krishna. I also do not agree with Iskcon regarding the guru siddhanta and many other deviations from Srila Prabhupada‟s teachings but I believe that we should not go against the law for correcting Iskcon.
2) AP devotees are collecting money in the name of feeding children but putting the money in other trusts. When I tried to find the truth about it, I came to know of many cases in Jaipur wherein AP devotees have collected money in the name of feeding children but have given HKM receipt to the donor which does not even have 100 percent tax exemption which was promised to the donor. It is unethical even according to MPP‟s own words which he wrote to me – “Even Srila Prabhupada did not mix up feeding and iskcon and created a separate iskcon food relief set up and so strict he was that he said not a single paisa collected for feeding should be used for anything else . We are very careful and sensitive to the Akshayaptra board’s decision not to mix up the two as they are two different organization especially in public eye . When we mix we loose very big corporate donors for the cause. Missionaries have two independent hats. One of Akshayaptra and other of Iskcon.”
3) I came to know from the letter of Gokul Chandra Prabhu of Hare Krishna Society that MPP had a closed door meeting with Iskcon EC and proposed to them that if Iskcon agrees that the 1st initiation will be performed by Srila Prabhupada then the 2nd initiation can be performed by regular pancaratrika gurus appointed by the GBC. I had heard about it from before but I did not get into the details as I had full faith in MPP that he can never think of going away from July 9th letter even in his dreams. So, at first I did not believe it but when I saw MPP‟s refutal on Sun Samprdaya I was shocked as this is accepted by MPP himself that he did make a proposal like this.
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The purpose of including MPP‟s favorable comments in the newspaper advt. which came on 19th January along with comments of other senior devotees like Gauri Das Pandit Prabhu and some college heads was to counteract the propaganda by AP devotees that HKC is bogus etc. But if I would have known of the above mentioned 3 things, I would have never included MPP‟s favorable comments for Hare Krishna Village along with comments of many respectable personalities because I do not agree with the above 3 points, first two of which are illegal even in the eye of the law.
I know that anyone can make mistake unless one is a liberated soul like Srila Prabhupada. The important thing is to accept and correct the mistake. We can discuss all these things in the meeting and if things are taken in a positive light then it will benefit everyone. We have left everything and come here to serve Srila Prabhupada and we should always remain with the truth. Please respond as important issues are at stake. I am ready to accept and rectify if there are some mistakes from my side but this negative propaganda from AP must stop for everyone‟s benefit.
I am sure you will see all that I have written with a positive frame of mind and try to organize a meeting wherein we can talk on these matters and come out with a peaceful solution. For all future mails regarding the “Struggle for Truth” by HKC, Jaipur devotees if some devotees to whom I am sending a copy of this mail do not want to be included in the cc list, please write to me and I will remove them from my cc list. I appeal to all the devotees who are reading this letter to stand for truth and help us to get justice?
If the senior Prabhupadnuga devotees do not intervene and if AP continues to do bad propaganda against HKC then in protection I will also have to take some steps to protect Srila Prabhupada‟s movement going on here by HKC devotees. The best way would be to call meetings of students, donors, general public etc. and tell them the truth. This way was suggested by MPP himself in my fight against Nimai Pandit.
Once again, right now my idea of co-operation is “Live and let live”. Chanchalpati Prabhu, if you remember these are the lines you told me in relation to Iskcon, many years back when we met in Govindevaji in Jaipur. I am sure you will be able to identify with the pain which all the devotees at HKC are going through. I will wait for 2-3 days and if I do not get any reply from you then I will assume that you do not care for any other Prabhupadanuga group of devotees which are not part of „your‟ organization. In that case you should stop calling Iskcon Bangalore as Srila Prabhupada’s Iskcon.
your servant,
Dayalu Nitai Das.
End of Part I, continued in Part II: JAIPUR STRUGGLE FOR TRUTH – II
Haribol!
It is unbelievable. This fighting must be stopped immediately. How can it be that Madhu Pandit Prabhu and Chanchalapati Prabhu don’t take strong steps to solve this problem?
YS Mathura Pati Das
I said Madhu was under handed 16 yrs ago. I said it in Vrndavan at the IRG meeting in front of 12 others. finally you devotees get it!
he is no friend to Srila Prabhupada’s DVD movement. Prabhupada would never build Disneyland at a cost of $100 million when there isn’t even ONE functioning DVD village on the ENTIRE PLANET!!
Remember this DVD movement is the only movement Srila Prabhupada made. any other interpretation, is just another’s speculation on just who, what, when, where, and how the cosmology of this movement should look.
follow the sinister movement, have a sinister effect and result
Hare Krishna !
I was in jaipur for my studies , at that time many students who were coming to HKC/BIG Gyan for Sunday program but after going to akshay patra they started speaking that BIG Gyan is bogus, Dayalu prabhu wanted post in Iskcon bangalore etc. etc. They said akshay patra devotees have mails from Dayalu Nitai prabhu in which he demanded post . One student Sahadev Jat told Raghav Pandit prabhu that they take the new students in room inside Akshay Patra campus and preach them negatively against HKC and Dayalu prabhu. They are lairs actually.
Hari Bol prabhus !
As usual fights everywhere. Between FISKCON and FISKCON. Between FISKCON and Ritviks and also Ritviks and Ritviks.
Now there may be many comments from both sides but i am interested in WHEN and WHAT MADHU PANDIT will reply ? What is his answers for all this ?? What is his stand on this issue that is most important than others comments and arguments. He took 4 years but still not stopping Iskcon Bangalore’s akshay patra devotees.
The mail is very clear and straight and it seems to me that HKC devotees acted very naively instead of knowing Iskcon bangalore’s policy (if it is). Why they waited so long even after there is no reply from Chanchalapati and Madhupandit ??
Normally I think very good about Madhu Pandit Prabhu and aksaya Patra but if he or Chanchalapati Prabhu don’t organize a meeting with Doyalu Prabhu ……… So then it is a sign that they are not nice devotees !
The way that Iskcon Bangalore devotees and the Bangalore devotees that are preaching(?) in Jaipur are acting is disgusting. They are in big maya no doubt. They need to pull their heads out of their rear ends and breath some fresh air, their brains aren’t working, the prabhus from HKC are their supposed to be their allies, friends, godbrothers, etc. But with friends like this who needs enemies?? I have heard first and accounts from some godbrothers about Bangalore and their ‘group’ of temples including the one in Sunnyvale ca.,usa, I didn’t want to believe that these accounts were true but reading what a nightmare these prabhus from the HKC are going through I will believe them now. Bangalore temple, it’s management team, it’s ‘group’ of temples including the one(s) in the usa are a bunch of racist, discriminating bigots. Just like the bogus iskcon gbc and their cronies, apparently it’s their way or the highway. They should be ashamed of the way that they are behaving, I know that they have just lost my support and I will be telling my friends about this incident also and they will feel the same I’m sure.
I kinda sounds like to me that they are very envious of the results that you are getting and are trying to stop it by hook or crook. Bhakta John said it right ” fights everywhere”, man what a great example for the world huh. What a joke, all I can do is shake my head in disbelief.
I would also like to say congratulations to the HKC devotees in Jaipur, it sounds like you are doing great preaching work and having good results! Despite the challenges you are having from iskcon and Bangalore you seem to be having good success I’m sure that Srila Prabhupada is pleased. Keep up the good work.
Yhs, ofs.
Hare Krishna,
please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
@Bhakta John “WHAT MADHU PANDIT will reply ?”
The unfortunate answer is that Madhu Pandit Dasa just stays silent and is not evening willing to cooperate to serve Srila Prabhupada.
On Gaurapurnima 2014 I went to Akshaya Patra Jaipur in order to invite the Akshaya Patra devotees for the Prabhupadanuga Festival. We just offered them to make peace, have Kirtan and discuss how we can cooperate to serve Srila Prabhupada’s mission. But the vice president of Akshaya Patra Jaipur (Ananta Shesha Dasa) immediately rejected the invitation. So they do not want to cooperate.
Madhu Pandit seems to be going the same road the catholic church has gone. Building expensive temples while the general mass of people suffers. No farm communities, no gurukul, no street sankirtan. All these things are done by Hare Krishna Community Jaipur.
Before I came to India, I was naive and thought Bangalore is the only hope for the Prabhupadanugas worldwide. But now that I know their real nature, I can only advice to stop donating to them. These american style mega churches is not what this movement needs.
ys.
Bhakta Robin
Hare Krishna !
I am student in Jaipur, doing b.tech. Attending HKC’s youth preaching program from last 3 years.
Akshay patra devotees have done great disservice here by making false stories about HKC Jaipur in last 4 years. They have misled the many students by telling false stories. They even send SMS to students that HKC is bogus. We have all the proofs (SMS, Call recordings).
Just want to know when Madhu Pandit prabhu will come for meeting ??? HKC devotees are writing him from last 4-5 years , all the mails are available but instead of stopping this great disturbance done by AP devotees he is keeping quite. Is there any TRUTHFUL person in IB/AP group who can come forward for a peaceful meeting ????
Please madhu pandit prabhu you are very senior come forward for meeting and have a peaceful solution so that we can serve our Spiritual Master Srila Prabhupada.
Yours
Pradeep Saraswat
i am pursuing my btech from jecrc college i am in 4th year and practicing Krishna consciousness with hkc devotees from past three years. AP jaipur devotees are blaspheming hkc and their devotees from past five years,making false stories about hkc and telling that hkc is bogus and even their vice president anantsesh das sent sms like this, many AP devotees even called to students telling them not to go there. “we are HAVING PHONE RECORDINGS AND SMS REGARDING THE ABOVE MATTER”
Why madhu pandit prabhu not stooping JAIPUR AP DEVOTEES regarding such BLASPHEMING even after receiving repeated mails from HKC devotees .
Lets pray to PRABHUPAD and KRISHNA to give intellegence to IB and AP devotees so that they come for an open meeting as the whole world is now inquiring about this.
Hare Krishna prabhu
your servant
Khushal Kothari
I had absolutely no clue that all this was going on . Only after reading Dayalu Nitai Prabhu’s email on Prahlad Das Prabhu’s blog, i came to know all this.
Its really so annoying and painful to see how someone can dare to blasphame Dayalu Nitai Prabhu. He is such a sincere soul and has been honestly carrying out orders of Srila Prabhupada from past decade.
I can still remember, 10 years down the line when i used to go to him for C-Programming lang classes . He used to give regular little doses of K.C with top most sincerity, honesty and sheer joy.
Just because of his sincerity and honestly, i was attracted to K.C and Srila Prabhupada . I am million times indebted to him.
I really wonder what will be the fate of such people who have inimical attitude towards real followers of Srila Prabhupada
Hare Krishna to all devotees here.
AP devotees are calling HKC bogus in their sms,phone calls and on face to the students and breaking the faith of students in senior devotees of HKC and hence creating a great disturbance in a preaching movement of Srila Prabhupada. They say don’t go to HKC.
but the very fact is AP devotees are actually doing bogus things like:
1. telling untruth about HKC
2. pushing to the student to join temple somehow or other (by showing money, by destroying their academic certificates). They proposed to my friend Kishan Gorai ( who is a regular devotee at HKC) to join and we will pay all your loans. They fired the academic certificates of Shantosh Kumar Mundra just to make him join, but he left the movement. My friend, Anurag dwivedi (VIT college) left movement because AP devotees pushed him alot for joining against his will for which even Lord Krishna have given free will. you can inspire someone for devotional service but how can you force someone ??? Surrender is voluntarily
3. catching those students who are preached by HKC and preach them negatively about HKC and thus breaking them like Satyaprakash (SKIT College), Divyanshu (SKIT College), Bhuvanesh Gupta , Chetan Mangal (Gyan Vihar College), Rahul jha (COMPUCOM college), Chandraprakash (MGM College), Ashok (SKIT college), Kundan (SKIT college), Pradeep (JECRC college )and a long list.
4. telling to the donors that HKC have no GO-SHALA, do not give them donation. But the very fact is HKC have BHAKTIVEDANTA GOSHALA with 100 cows and AP has hardly 8 cows for which they are collecting donations !!!
5. telling that HKC is not following Prabhupada.
6. They kick out the students/devotees who point out their deviations or raise some genuine questions about their policies.
7. telling that the initiation of HKC devotee is not valid. How ridiculous ???
PLEASE see and judge WHO IS BOGUS ??????
It is obvious to anyone with half a brain that the dispute between HKC and the Bangalore group boils down to men and money. HKC is having great success and is funneling off what Bangalore desperately needs MEN AND MONEY!!! How else are they going to build Krsna world in Vrndavana along with whatever other humungous over endeavor projects they have thought up. THEY NEED MEN AND MONEY AND LOTS OF BOTH!!! First off men to make the money to spend on their projects and then more men to open up more centers to make more men and money. It’s a self perpetuating plan just steam rolling along and if anyone gets in their way and messes with their plans like the HKC is doing ……… well then, Houston we have a problem.
I’m sure that Sri Sri Gaura Nitai and Srila Prabhupada are really pleased with what they are doing to the sankirtan movment.
The Bangalore management team should be ashamed of their conduct but since it has been going on now for four years it seems like that they could really give a crap what anyone else thinks about their policies.
It reminds me of the old days in the 70’s with the New Vrndavan and Tamal Krsna (Radha Damodara) traveling sankirtan parties burning up the cities as they blew through leaving a burned out town and a po’d temple in their wake, finally Prabhupada had to step in and set things straight. So apparently the Bangalore devotees agree with the bogus iskcon on this one, that Srila Prabhupada isn’t here now, he is now dead and gone, and so they can do anything that they damn well please to whom ever they want whenever they want. After all no one is watching right! That is the only logical conclusion that a person can come to because that is how they are acting!!! THAT NO BODY IS WITNESSING WHAT THEIR ACTIVITIES!!!! They don’t even know the basic philosophy. What a shame. If they don’t change their tactics they should be blacklisted.
Ys. Ofs.
Hare Krishna To all!!! I am an engineering student currently in my final year studying in jaipur, few months back I happened to pass by one of the akshaya patra’s “secret of success” billboard in sitapura near Mahatma gandhi medical college.Seeing the board I called the person whose number was there at the bottom of the advertisement.I came to know that the number was of a full time brahamchari devotee (madhav charan das).on asking him about whether I should go to Hare krishna center,sitapura which is located in the same area where i live or should I come to akshaya patra, jagatpura….and to my surprise he (madhav charan das) went on and on blaspheming devotees of hkc and he even went to the point of saying that hkc is a completely bogus organization and you will be ruined spiritually if you go there.I have complete recordings of the 30 min conversation i had with him that day.I was very surprised by the way this devotee spoke and the fact that I WAS CALLING HIM FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME.IS THIS SORT OF BEHAVIOUR FROM A FULL TIME DEVOTEE CORRECT Mr.Madhupandit das ji???Do you have any answers to this???Are you working to strengthen srila prabhupada’s mission or trying to create a rift between other devotees and spreding misunderstandings in innocent public .I just fail to understand one thing that why these ap people are so jealous of hkc devotees ,just because these very sincere devotees are selflessly working day and night to satisfy Srila Prabhupada and expanding his mission of establishing varnashram!!!
.
harekrishna to al the devotees here.
i am really surprised of the facts that i have known on reading this letter.it so painful that a dispute has arose between two prabupadanugas centres.i personally know how AP is rendering great service in all cenres it had.it was not digestable to me that AP devotees had done like that in jaipur.i had the gretest respect for MPP and all other senior devotees of iskcon banglore.i think that what the meeting that has been intended should be immediately conducted to settle this issue.i really want to see dat both centres would mingle for the cause of srila prabupads original movement unlike involving in a cold war like this.
Hare Krsna to all Devotees. Please Accept my humble obeisances. Dandvat Pranam. All Glories to Srila Prabhupad.
I live in delhi. I have completed my graduation from Jaipur and so, in a way was in touch with HKC because i used to attend Bhagavad Gita Seminars conducted by Dayalu Nitayi Prabhu when i was in final year of graduation as well as i sometimes used to visit Akshaypatra also because my best friend Ravi is a big donor of Akshaypatra. Ravi’s father also participated as one of The Chief Guests at the inauguration function of Akshaypatra Jaipur.
We never knew about the nasty things which AP was doing with HKC people as i was associated with them since 2010. And, Because they never told us even a single word about AP in their seminars…..I used to wonder why so many students which were introduced to Krsna Consciousness by Dayalu Prabhu went away from HKC and started attending programmes in AP ? Why they used to call us to come to AP saying its better here in AP. I tried sometimes to ask HKC Brahmcharis that whats going on but they never told us. Then i tried to know the things from those students who migrated to AP from HKC. They told me that Dayalu Prabhu was initially in Akshaypatra and he demanded some big post there but AP refused to give it so he left AP and opened a new centre thats why we should not go there and its Bogus. But i liked to attend Gita Seminars there and i found no bad feelings in any of the associates of HKC against AP and my life was totally changed due to association of devotees of HKC so, i continued to attend HKC Programmes.
Then, gradually i completed my studies in jaipur and left the place in 2011. But used to visit at big functions like Janmashtmi, new year, etc.
Now what happened in January 2014 is that HKC organised a big program and gave advert in some newspaper. I was already there for some services. My friend Ravi(big donor of AP), He saw that Advert in newspaper but he didn’t noticed that HKC, Jaipur is organising that function. He mistakenly called in Akshaypatra to Ananta Veerya Das(Secretary in AP……i guess) to enquire about entry passes. Mr. Ananta Veerya misunderstood him as some person associated with HKC and scolded him. Moreover, Mr. Ananta Veerya texted him 3-4 messages in which he cursed him to fall in ditch along with Dayalu Prabhu. He was so disgusted by that. And he called me right away and we met later that day and he showed me all the texts send by Mr. Ananta Veerya Das.
I told these things to HKC Brahmcharis and they told me to keep quite for the time being. As function was just on the head. One more strange thing which i witnessed by my own was that a businessman got ready to donate some amount for the function and he invited HKC Brahmcharis next morning. I was the one who accompanied those devotees to that Businessman’s place. We were feeling happy about that when we approached him. But, suddenly he denied to donate. While asking the reason he apologised that he committed to donate but now he won’t. He said that he will never donate to HKC in his life. While we insisted him, He annoyingly said that he may send that amount to AP or He can fire it up in front of us but he won’t donate to HKC. I was totally shocked and left the place speechless. Anyhow, the function went well by the mercy of Srila Prabhupad.
The next day after function Dayalu Prabhu called up all the students, donors, congregation for a meeting and told us all the things happened from the very beginning. THAT WAS THE FIRST TIME WE CAME TO KNOW WHAT EXACTLY WAS GOING ON AND HOW MUCH HARASSMENT AP DID TO HKC IN LAST 4-5 YEARS. He showed us various proofs like sound recordings, so many students who witnessed those things to prove his allegation against AP.
Next evening me and my friend Ravi visited AP to ask them about all these nonsense going on but they again and again tried to prove HKC bogus without having a valid reason and when we told them about sound recordings we had of AP members calling HKC bogus and abusing TP of HKC then, they said that the one who record the things secrectly is actually the culprit and what is the need of recording things ?? hahaha. Just see how sweet they are !!
My friend was totally disgusted with AP and he had lost complete faith in them.
Later i came to know so many discrepancies, illegal activities going on in AP there. Which i can’t even discuss here that can shatter the faith people have in AP.
i m so much respectful to mmp but after watcing the little trailor of the big picture about hkc jaipur i m just thinking why he is not solving all this matters,this is very bad
“I wish that each and every branch shall keep their separate identity and cooperate keeping the acharya in the center. On this principle we can open any number of branches all over the world. The RamaKrishna mission works on this principle and thus as an organization they have done wonderfully.” (Prabhupada Letter, February 11, 1967)
pamho agtACBSP, CHANDAN YATRA KI JAI
Wow i can’t believe until i heard this through this good website daily news. Actually this is the proof that it’s not easy at all to be free from the three gunas, I mean more high one goes and more one have to be nistham otherwise one get subjected to the entaglement with the three guna by deviating from the right vaisnava etiquette.
Of course one life is not enough to be situated beyond the three guna therefore i’m not surprised to hear this bad news regarding HG madhu pandit prabhu. Bhakti is a very slow process because it takes many lives before one reach the stage of pukka brahma nistham but nehabrikamo naso sthi, even a small step toward perfection is never lost and one can start from the next life. We are the same living entities that are waiting to be situated in param brahman because everything is already situated there since time immemorial and now we need to be situated there, I mean that’s possible only when we get the causeless mercy called by SRI SRI GURU GAURANGA, otherwise kapotya kutinadi, envy and duality will make the process slower in the way back.
This means also that one have to look more to the individual journey by find out the own spiritual svarupa body because SRI RSABHADEVA said that the condizioned soul should never reincarnate in this material body which is very troublesome through harrassement cheating exploitment etc. all the forms of life comes from SRI ADVIATA ACYUTAM ANADIM ANANTA RUPAM, and the proof of this is the sublime krsna lila with HIS friends when they got kidnapped by LORD BRAHMA. This meditation can help a lot to become a brahma nistham by cultivating the own spiritual journey without troubles bacause nobody knows us better then krsna said SRILA PRABHUPADA,.
Anyway, a wise man learns by mistakes and if one doesn’t it means he is not so wise man by repenting and pay respect to the devotees instead of give them problems.
agtSP ys haribol
iskcon bangalore is going is in wrong direction . they will get karma for this
Hare Krsna
All glories to Srila Prabhupada
I am Dharmvitta Das. Recently got initiation at HKC via ritvik system and now a initiated disciple of Srila Prabhupada.
I am serving at HKC from last 5 years and now conducting regular namahatta program near my house with the help of HKC devotees.
I am listening these AP devotees Bad propaganda against HKC from last many years and telling to HKC devotees to do something for this, they always replied that we are writing to Madhu Pandit prabhu and CPP and when meeting will take place we can raise questions and speak the truth but in a peaceful law abiding way.. But MPP and CPP never cared for these mails. Is this the way devotees act ????
Recently one FOLK (AP youth preaching unit) boy Hemant told to my friend Shivaram not to go to HKC as they are BOGUS, come to AP only.
Two FOLK boys told to my another friend Vishnu that AP temple is very BIG , you should don’t go to HKC. Do you want a simple dry chapati or a chapati sunk in Ghee ?
I am amazed that what kind of boys joining AP movement…
Two of my other friends Dilip and Bharat, currently studying in Poornima College in jaipur, told me that two FOLK (AP) boys met them and told that don’t go to HKC they are not authorized, come to AP beco’z it is actually ISKCON.
This is what they preach to students and say we are preaching.
What is AP’s motto ? preaching or cheating.
Is this ISKCON Bangalore’s official response?
I’m shocked that they have actually published this obvious (and offensive) nonsense on their ISKCON Times website!
http://www.iskcontimes.com/misleading-article-on-prabhupada-anuga-eu-against-madhu-pandit-dasa
What is Puranjana (Tim Lee) talking about? He has zero basis, its’ 100% distortion and lies. Did he even acknowledge the fact that HKC devotees have been the target of attacks and harassment at all? He took HKC’s sincere complaints against AP devotees and the terror they have been causing and reversed them, completely flipped the actual truth of the matter to point the blame towards HKC as the instigators.
You can easily read through poor tim tim’s rhetoric and see his bias towards bangalore. He is not impartial whatsoever. I would imagine he gets some sort of compensation for his propaganda 666 blog, from Bangalore/Yasodanandana. An impartial eye is crucial on this issue, unfortunately most devotees have taken shelter in Bangalore because “they are the only ones doing anything”, which is not true, they are the most well funded undoubtedly. Jaipur HKC is doing awesome preaching in the name of Prabhupada and there are also other small time temples/homes or farms that are also working sincerely towards Prabhupadas mission. Bangalore is trying to OWN the term “Prabhupadanuga” and make a central power under their control/agenda, using their GBC. This is clearly Machiavellian/demoniac tactics as Srila Prabhupada wanted every temple to be independent and locally governed/run. This is why Jaipur HKC devotees and ANY OTHER sincere devotees who want a Prabhupadanuga program apart from the control mechanisms of Bangalore are in danger and facing these aggressions. I feel this is a very important issue at this point, that for too long has gone unnoticed and unchecked.
To Puranjana (PADA):
You keep saying that HKC devotees are aligned with the GBC, but they do not say that. They say that the High Court has found MPP guilty. Stating facts of a case does not make anyone on anyone’s side. If you say the sky is blue and the GBC says the sky is blue, does not make you and the GBC on the same side, you bonehead. You are attacking the Jaipur devotees the same way the GBC attacked you. That is where you learned how to be such an [snip]. HKC are asking questions about MPP and you are attacking them without even knowing the full story. and you want to attack GDP for giving initiations in Jaipur by trying to link Jaipur to the GBC. You’re an idiot for trying to link Jaipur to GBC. Now you are making all Prabhupadanugas look like idiots for trying to link Jaipur to GBC. No one will ever believe anything you post from now on. Everyone knows you are dishonest. It here for everyone to see.
No one is siding with anyone. HKC devotees are simply asking MMP questions and you have decided to jump in and attack everyone for asking MMP a question. You are grasping at straws to make HKC devotees look bad. They are not linked to anyone, especially not the GBC. The GBC does not endorse GDP giving initiations in Jaipur, so there is no link between GBC and Jaipur. Stating that the HC of India has found MPP guilty does not make anyone a supporter of the GBC, it just makes MPP guilty in the eyes of the court, the same court you went to with Turley. So if the courts are good for your side, then they are good for the other side, but you don’t want to hear that. You want to decide which court decision is correct, although Prabhupada said that if you do not recognize the law, you are insane. they will put you in jail and force you to recognize, like your buddy Tirtha.
pamho agtACBSP
He used to have a very good reputation normally, I feel sorry to hear about that, the devotional path it’s the best path that’s why sometime is difficulty to go back home in one life only. But nehabrikamo naso sthi even a small step toward this bhakti yoga path can make us free from the most dangerous fear at the end of the supreme punishment so called death for whoever accepted a material body must prepare himself for ante narayana smrti to not get more punished than that, and unless one knows his spiritual identity one is subjected to get involved through this kind of attack on the devotees because the three guna of material nature don’t leave us free so easily.
Hard work first then samadhi used to say our guru maharaj, mukti does not come immediately, maybe bhukti is easily available but not bhakti mukti and siddhi one must work seriously to come alive again because until one is engaged in mukti bhukti siddhi entaglement one can’t get pure bhakti and even a mukta purusa has to pay the reactions for accepting a material body after death because nobody is karma free in mrityu-loka the planet of the living dead, everyone has got some kind of karma reactions to pay, therefore we can’t considered a bona fide leader whoever is not karma free yet.
We can see that through the factor time I mean nobody could think like this of hg madhu pandit prabhu misbehavior in 2014 that’s why i said normally he used to have a good reputation, anyway the anarthas are not eternal by fortune and anyone can find the way out by praying sincerely SRILA PRABHUPADA.
agtSP ys haribol
Has the High Court of India charged MPP with his guilty misconduct ?
If it is so, can some body please post or send the link of CHARGES by the HC of India against MPP ?
Thank you.
Hari BOL. AGTSP.
Hare Krishna
All glories to Srila Prabhupada , our Spiritual Master.
@ Amar Puri prabhu, below is the link
http://judgmenthck.kar.nic.in/judgments/bitstream/123456789/536696/1/RFA421-09-23-05-2011.pdf
Thank you Prabhu Ram Bhakta Das for posting the link.
Wow……. It is first time I am reading this. So much drama is going on ALL in the name of serving Srila Prabhupada’s Spiritual mission.
Finally, it comes to the ” intent and purpose ” who is rendering SELFLESS service to spread the Holy name of the Lord in every town and village.
It does not matter who WINS the court case before the Supreme Court.
What matters the most is that who so ever is sincerely and truly UP HOLDING the principles of TRUTH in spreading and serving SELFLESSLY Srila Prabhupada’s VANI wins the battle and comes out victorious as Maharaja Yudishtra and His Pandva brothers did in the battle field of Kurukesthra under the direction of the Lord.
OM TAT SAT.
Hari BOL. AGTSP.
Nepotism, cooking the books, false statements, tampering with documents!…..This seems to be a damning inditement by the High Court of Madhu Pandit! Why is it that I am not surprised?
Vaisnava Dasanudas
Sudarsana
Hare Krishna
All glories to Srila Prabhupada , our Spiritual Master.
You must have gone through the link and read the high court judgement , since the judgement is very long i will print the following few lines from that judgement which are alarming :
In Para 70 the High Court has explained as follows :
“Further, Madhupandit Das, his wife Bhakti Lata Devi Dasi, his co-brother Chanchalapati Das, his wife’s sister Chamari Devi Dasi and other close associates cooked up reports specifying the names of these persons as elected office bearers of plaintiff society and filed the same in the office of Registrar of Societies for the first time on 21.08.2001 for the entire period of 12 years from 1989 to 2001. As already stated these reports are cooked up for the purpose of giving life to the defunct plaintiff society.”
It is an open fact known to devotees on both sides that Madhu Pandit forged the documents, bribed the government officials, threatened people with dire consequences if they go against him etc. to prove to the court that ISKCON Bangalore property belongs to a trust owned by MPP’s family members and not the branch of Iskcon. Now this high court order has been challenged by MPP in the Supreme court where the decision is awaiting.
Ram Bhakta Das: Bangalore property belongs to a trust owned by MPP’s family members and not the branch of Iskcon. Now this high court order has been challenged by MPP in the Supreme court where the decision is awaiting.
Mahesh: We all know that there is a BIG issue in terms of Prabhupadanugas in Jaipur because there are at least 3 temples fighting for a SMALL percentage of donors. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc.
The issue IS: Is Madhu Pandit PRO Ritvik or ANTI Ritvik? And is he going to PUT UP the FIGHT FOR RITVIK CAUSE to the END to fight the ANTI RITVIK GOONS? THAT is the ISSUE here.
1) What “branch of Iskcon” would that be? The BOMBAY (Anti Srila Prabhupada as Diksa Guru) Anti Ritvik bunch of CROOKS? And why would he want to just give them on a plate what they have worked hard for all the years to some ANTI RITVIK CROOKS? These goons have sided AGAINST SRILA PRABHUPADA AS OUR DIKSA GURU so WHY give them ANYTHING?
2) It is also A FACT in India High court Judges are BRIBED to give Judgements. HOW MUCH DID BOMBAY WALAS (ANTI RITVIK GOONS) PAY THE HIGH COURT JUDGE? Let is not forget the stake is HUGE Bangalore Temple.
Just look at the ANTI RITVIK goons history for MONEY SCREWING IN ISKCON. They want TO SCREW MONEY AT ALL LEVELS:
Bhaktivedanta Manor Accounts SALARIES
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=38907#comment-24810
http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Accounts/Ends49/0000259649_ac_20111231_e_c.pdf
3) Ram Bhakta Das: “Now this high court order has been challenged by MPP in the Supreme Court where the decision is awaiting.”
So let us ALL see what SUPREME COURT decides. For Madhu Pandit to take it up to the SUPREME COURT THERE MUST BE SOMETHING THAT HE HAS WHICH IS WORTH FOR THE JUDGE TO HEAR. Otherwise WHY would he go to the limit of SUPREME COURT?
To come back to the ORIGIN we want to see the ALL the temples in the hands of PRABHUPADANUGAS and NOT some bunch of ANTI RITVIK GOONS.
Mahesh Raja Prabhu,
PAMHO. AGTSP.
As usual your comments are presented with well thought out, no doubt, to which I agreed with it.
I also find the following statement in your comments further thought provoking in which an explanation to the questions as under is needed by the Learned Readers like yourself ;
Mahesh: ” We all know that there is a BIG issue in terms of Prabhupadanugas in Jaipur because there are at least 3 temples fighting for a SMALL percentage of donors. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc. ”
My questions ;
1. Are these Three temples i.e. a. Jaipur Devotee group under the leadership of Shriman DND Prabhu, b. Akshaya Patra of Jaipur and c. Shri MPP – IB., which you are referring , Mahesh Prabhu ?
2. If it is so, then, are these three establishments run under different Leaderships NOT Prabhupadanuga meaning following and serving SELFLESSLY the mission of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupada’s Instructions – VANI ?
3. If it is so, they are INDEED following and serving SELFLESSLY the mission of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupadas’s Instructions, then, what do you mean by this when you say ; ” ……. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc.
Why each one wants to say they are the best IF and WHEN their ” intent and purpose ” reamain the SAME i.e. to serve the mission of HDG. Srila Prabhupada SELFLESSLY ?
Where is the need naturally to create the tension between them—and they speak against one another ?
4. What is your PLAN and HOW do you see to execute it when you say this ; ” To come back to the ORIGIN we want to see the ALL the temples in the hands of PRABHUPADANUGAS and NOT some bunch of ANTI RITVIK GOONS.” ???
I humbly beg to seek the answers to the above cited QUESTIONS from all the Learned Readers.
Thank you.
Hari BOL.
All Glories to Srila Prabhupada and His Dedicated Sincere and Serious Followers World Wide.
YS……. Amar Puri.
Hare Krishna
All glories to Srila Prabhupada , our Spiritual Master.
@ Mahesh Raja:
You wrote “We all know that there is a BIG issue in terms of Prabhupadanugas in Jaipur because there are at least 3 temples fighting for a SMALL percentage of donors. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc.”
I think the issue is not so simple as you have put up. If you read the open letters carefully written by HKC devotees to Madhu Pandit, you will see that there is a whole lot of centralizing policy, not allowing any other Prabhupadanuga group to preach unless they surrender to the absolute authority of Madhu Pandit. This is completely against the teachings of Srila Prabhupada. As it is clear from the open letter HKC was already having their center and preaching in Jaipur, AP came later on and got established and asked HKC to close down and move somewhere else and when HKC did not comply they branded them as bogus. A typical deviant GBC style of working. All this is cause of great alarm.
Our concern should be that if some body is standing for the ritvika cause does it give him a licence to do illegal activities, take the law in his hand, banish all those even if they may be PRabhupadanugas who do not come under his umbrella etc etc?
Even if Madhu Pandit wins this case he will be able to get hold off one ISKCON Temple and will be allowed to use name “ISKCON” in Karnataka only, I mean to say to achieve this short end, is it advisable to take risk of forging papers, doing fraud, bribing, employing goondas etc etc? We are already seeing the bad result of this approach in the form of such a strong High Court order. Moreover if Madhu Pandit mistreats other Prabhupadanuga devotees, promotes centralization of power and many other deviations from the pure teachings of Srila Prabhupada. What would be the use even if he wins the court case ? For which he is spending so much time , money, energy and taking shelter of bribes, forging documents etc etc. Main issue is that if the Prabhupadanuga devotees become pure and exhibit all good qualities that will attract so many devotees to embrace Ritvikism , this can not be achieved by wining or losing court cases.
Srila Prabhupada says “”What profiteth a man if he gain the whole world yet suffers the loss of his eternal soul?””
Hari Bol prabhus.
I think all the devotees who are reading this article and the comments on it should not forget the main complaint against Madhu Pandit or AP Jaipur devotees. That is :
Madhu Pandit – Why are you creating problems for the HKC Jaipur devotees?
Why are your Akshaya Patra (AP) people attacking
Dayalu Nitai of Hare Krishna Community Jaipur?
Also please read the initial comments from devotees and students, its very clear that AP devotees have done wrong in last 4 years.
I am still amazed that none of the IB group’s senior devotee is coming forward or either replying HKC’s mail. What does it mean ? If all this is UNTRUTH so Madhu Pandit and AP Jaipur devotees should discard and clarify the things.
And on the other hand IB is publishing Tim Lee’s (aka PADA) non sense article !! [snip]
—– Forwarded Message —–
From: Madhu Pandit Dasa
To: [snip]
Sent: Sunday, 25 May 2014, 9:47
Subject: RE:http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=41313#comment-26533
Please correct them that it is a big fat lie that the Bangalore Property is owned by a trust owned by MPP’s family members. The property belongs to ISKCON Society registered in Bangalore in the year 1978, much before even I joined ISKCON. But ISKCON Society at Bangalore is legally separate from ISKCON Society registered in Bombay. The dispute is whether we are a branch of Bombay Society or ISKCON Bangalore is an independent society holding and managing the properties allotted to it by the government through its own governing body consisting of 10 members elected out of 23 temple presidents. So where is the family issue? It is just false propaganda by the gurus. Ys mpd
Amar Puri:
My questions ;
1. Are these Three temples i.e. a. Jaipur Devotee group under the leadership of Shriman DND Prabhu, b. Akshaya Patra of Jaipur and c. Shri MPP — IB., which you are referring , Mahesh Prabhu ?
Mahesh: I have not been to Jaipur. I have only HEARD that there are 3 temples (1 IB temple 2) DND prabhus 3) Gopal Krsna (ISKCON)? affiliated.
2. If it is so, then, are these three establishments run under different Leaderships NOT Prabhupadanuga meaning following and serving SELFLESSLY the mission of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupada’s Instructions — VANI ?
Mahesh: Again – because we are hear IB and DND folks that are in the news we can say this are Prabhupadanuga folks.
3. If it is so, they are INDEED following and serving SELFLESSLY the mission of our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupadas’s Instructions, then, what do you mean by this when you say ; ” ……. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc.
Why each one wants to say they are the best IF and WHEN their ” intent and purpose ” reamain the SAME i.e. to serve the mission of HDG. Srila Prabhupada SELFLESSLY ?
Where is the need naturally to create the tension between them—and they speak against one another ?
Mahesh: Unfortunately – this is something that I hear from various sources. I have not gone there so I do not know.
4. What is your PLAN and HOW do you see to execute it when you say this ; ” To come back to the ORIGIN we want to see the ALL the temples in the hands of PRABHUPADANUGAS and NOT some bunch of ANTI RITVIK GOONS.” ???
Mahesh: It is NOT MY PLAN It is Srila Prabhupada’s PLAN. ALL the parties MUST consider Srila Prabhupada’s wishes when he SAYS **cooperate** then if they DISOBEY Srila Prabhupada how can you move forward? If one WANTS to PROGRESS in spiritual life HOW can he DISOBEY Srila Prabhupada our Guru? It is 3rd OFFENSE in chanting the Holy Name to DISOBEY the Spiritual Master. So all battle-axes should be buried and SERIOUS consideration given to Srila Prabhupada WHAT HE WANTS. They may NOT LIKE EACH OTHER because of something said by one another BUT they HAVE TO sit down and TALK these things over: HOW they can SORT out these differences in PROGRESSIVE WAY to PLEASE SRILA PRABHUPADA. Otherwise they are DISOBEYING SRILA PRABHUPADA. tranad api sunicena humble than a blade of grass is NOT simply empty words they HAVE TO DO IT practically then Krsna ALLOW you to chant. If they are not going to obey Srila Prabhupada then the chanting will also be DRY – NO TASTE. Little TAPASYA required. “I am not this body is a nice slogan” BUT we have to put it to practice – THEN effects are there. We all know that chanting sometimes is like chewing bricks when the proper sadhna is not there. Yes? It is ALL practical. Humble than a blade of grass more tolerant then a tree these words are not empty words they have PROFOUND meaning. In order to come to the stage of ACTUAL chanting we SEE Krsna that is our GOAL. But if one does NOT want to be humble to accept Srila Prabhupada’s words then plenty of vacancies in 8,400,000 species of life in this material world.
76-01-05. Letter: Satsvarupa
EVERYTHING SHOULD BE DONE CO-OPERATIVELY. “Our” and “your’s” are material conceptions and have no place in our Krishna Consciousness movement. If the members of our movement are unable to co-operate it will be very difficult to spread the mission of Lord Caitanya.
72-11-18. Letter: Madhumangala
Regarding general state of affairs at Amsterdam temple, I can understand there is some disturbance among you, but that is not to be taken very seriously. Real business is preaching work, and if there is full attention on this matter only, all other businesses will be automatically successful. Fighting amongst ourselves is not at all good, but if our preaching work is neglected, or if we fall down in following the regulative principles such as rising before four, chanting 16 rounds, like that, if these things are not strictly observed then maya will enter and spoil everything. So my best advice to you is to strictly observe these things yourself and be the example so that all others may follow. WE SHOULD NOT CRITICIZE EACH OTHER, AS VAISNAVAS, BECAUSE THERE IS FAULT IN EVERYONE AND WE MAY BE OURSELVES SUBJECT TO CRITICISM. BEST THING IS TO BE ABOVE SUSPICION OURSELVES, THEN IF WE SEE DISCREPANCIES AND MAKE SUGGESTION THE OTHERS WILL AUTOMATICALLY RESPECT AND TAKE ACTION TO RECTIFY THE MATTERS. THAT IS COOPERATION. AND WE MUST EXIST ON SUCH COOPERATION, OTHERWISE THE WHOLE THING IS DOOMED IF WE SIMPLY GO ON FIGHTING OVER SOME SMALL THING. So try to organize things and preach together in this spirit, and that will please me very, very much.
“Guru-mukha-padma-vakya, cittete koriya aikya, ara na koriho mane asa. Don’t think of any nonsense. Simply execute what your guru has said. That is success.”
(28th January, 1977, Room Conversation)
Dear Webmaster,
Thank you for posting the reply from Shri MPP. Very interesting information indeed which many people did not know it perhaps.
As it states ; ” …… The dispute is whether we are a branch of Bombay Society or ISKCON Bangalore is an independent society holding and managing the properties allotted to it by the government through its own governing body consisting of 10 members elected out of 23 temple presidents. …… ”
That itself require to be clarified establishing Legally under which Lawfully authority the IB Temple building and its assets fall under the control of either Bomaby Society or Iskcon Bangalore society the intricacy of the court case of which is before the Supreme court of India pending a Judgement decision.
All of us, we can do is simply hope for the best that the ” intent and purpose ” of the management and administration of IB Temple are best suited for the mission of HDG. Srila Prabhupada Instructions and the VANI.
All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
As it appears that Ram Bhakta Das Prabhu starts his comments with ” I think the issue is ………………” and goes on to describe as per his mental state of Thinking, Feeling and Willing as to what he reads in the articles of Jaipur Devotees TRUTH – 1 under discussion simply accusing and blowing out of proportion with ill-remarks without knowing and explaining the answers to the Questions I put forth in the Article II. when he answers to Mahesh Raja Prabhu’s comments.
Isn’t it insane ? Where we are all going with this type of sentiments ? No answer – No solution, isn’t it ?
Based on the Articles of Jaipur Devotees TRUTH I and II, I have also given my comments and brought out the QUESTIONS on Part II of the Articles for further explanation to which date there is NO reply or explanation to my QUESTIONS by Shriman DND, or any of his representative. WHY ?
On what basis, we the Readers can know the REALITY until the answers to the Questions are given by the Writer or his representative who is seeking the TRUTH ?
Do you agree with me, Ram Bhakta Das Prabhu ?
First of all the issue is not who is rtvik and who is not.
The issue is why is MPP attacking and discrediting the good devotees of Jaipur?
this has not been answered. Mahesh Raja says that they want the money from donors that Jaipur has cultivated.
Secondly, Mahesh says it is a fact that High Court Judges are bribed, can he shows us an example where a high court Judge was convicted of taking a bribe? This is a huge crime. Can he show where a High court Judge was convicted of taking a bribe in the Bangalore Case? Anyone can say anything, but he hasn’t show where any HIgh Court Judge was bribed in this case. He just says, “It is also A FACT in India High court Judges are BRIBED to give Judgements.” Again, please show us a conviction of a high court Judge being bribed in MPP’s case.
Thanks for answering all the questions, Mahesh Raja Prabhu.
This Yes ? speaks volumes as described very nicely in your comments, no doubt.
Mahesh ;
” It is NOT MY PLAN It is Srila Prabhupada’s PLAN. ALL the parties MUST consider Srila Prabhupada’s wishes when he SAYS **cooperate** then if they DISOBEY Srila Prabhupada how can you move forward? If one WANTS to PROGRESS in spiritual life HOW can he DISOBEY Srila Prabhupada our Guru? It is 3rd OFFENSE in chanting the Holy Name to DISOBEY the Spiritual Master. So all battle-axes should be buried and SERIOUS consideration given to Srila Prabhupada WHAT HE WANTS. They may NOT LIKE EACH OTHER because of something said by one another BUT they HAVE TO sit down and TALK these things over: HOW they can SORT out these differences in PROGRESSIVE WAY to PLEASE SRILA PRABHUPADA. Otherwise they are DISOBEYING SRILA PRABHUPADA. tranad api sunicena humble than a blade of grass is NOT simply empty words they HAVE TO DO IT practically then Krsna ALLOW you to chant. If they are not going to obey Srila Prabhupada then the chanting will also be DRY — NO TASTE. Little TAPASYA required. “I am not this body is a nice slogan” BUT we have to put it to practice — THEN effects are there. We all know that chanting sometimes is like chewing bricks when the proper sadhna is not there. Yes? It is ALL practical. Humble than a blade of grass more tolerant then a tree these words are not empty words they have PROFOUND meaning. In order to come to the stage of ACTUAL chanting we SEE Krsna that is our GOAL. But if one does NOT want to be humble to accept Srila Prabhupada’s words then plenty of vacancies in 8,400,000 species of life in this material world. ”
Exactly keeping this …….. tranad api sunicena humble than a blade of grass … in mind, I suggested in my comments on Jaipur Devotees Article II to the Leader Shriman DND in response to Prahlad Das Prabhu which reads ;
” My question is that does Shriman DND Prabhu as a Leader take the RESPONSIBILITY of OWNING the mistake he committed to print out the UNAUTHORIZED endorsement of MPP — IB as he cited in the article under reference as brought out and pointed out in my comments ?
If the answer is YES, then, where is the PROOF ? If the answer is NO, then …… ” Calling an honest man a thief as it were. ……….. ” written by Prahlad Das Prabhu is certainly NOT wrong. Isn’t it ? ”
So how the differences can be resolved ?
Ananny Mouse says: ” The issue is why is MPP attacking and discrediting the good devotees of Jaipur? ”
As it appears from the Jaipur Devotees Article under reference that the Leader Shriman DND made a mistake to print the UNAUTHORIZED endorsement of MMP – IB,
However, the Leader Shriman DND is not taking the RESPONSIBILITY of OWNING the mistake he committed that which brings the discredit to the good devotees of Jaipur.
Is this not a FACT ?
Mr ‘Mouse’ is making a very valid point here! The real point is who is following sincerely the directions given by His Divine Grace and previous Acharyas? Most of GBC have been ‘initiated’ by the ritvik process but they are simply miscreants as are the other GBC’s who were initiated ‘directly’ by Srila Prabhupada, but NEITHER are following the principals necessary to advance in spiritual life.
If there is ‘bribery’ then proof is REQUIRED otherwise it is simply hearsay, even though such things are not very surprising in the “legal system” anywhere in the world, what to speak of India.
Only the greatest fool would BUY the GBC’s “A blind uncle is better than no uncle” philosophy as they are not ONLY blind but DEAD also! Sounds like they should make a movie together (as they are all accomplished actors!) THE BOGUS GURUS OF THE LIVING DEAD. fictional/crime/horror which starts and ends very badly!
It is not necessary to ‘validate’ ones position by using the ‘rubber stamp’ of ritvik etc as these things can come back to ‘bite us’ later on just like the ‘Fair Trade’ logo which has created an ”automatic subliminal validation” but has become very misleading over time, with many ‘producers’ of goods getting paid even less than they were ‘before’ due to corruptive influences that always have a habit of reappearing!
Daso Smi
Sudarsana
Ananny Mouse says: First of all the issue is not who is rtvik and who is not.
Marica: I think Mahesh Raja Prabhu’s issue is very important. Why ?
“…The actual fact is that everyone is a servant of the Lord, as confirmed in Caitanya-caritāmṛta by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu (jīvera ‘svarūpa’ haya—kṛṣṇera ‘nitya-dāsa’ [Cc. Madhya 20.108]). As servants of the Lord, we are one, and there can be no questions of enmity or friendship. If one actually understands that every one of us is a servant of the Lord, where is the question of enemy or friend?
Everyone should be friendly for the service of the Lord. Everyone should praise another’s service to the Lord and not be proud of his own service. This is the way of Vaiṣṇava thinking, Vaikuṇṭha thinking. There may be rivalries and apparent competition between servants in performing service, but in the Vaikuṇṭha planets the service of another servant is appreciated, not condemned. This is Vaikuṇṭha competition. There is no question of enmity between servants. Everyone should be allowed to render service to the Lord to the best of his ability, and everyone should appreciate the service of others. Such are the activities of Vaikuṇṭha. Since everyone is a servant, everyone is on the same platform and is allowed to serve the Lord according to his ability. As confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā (15.15), sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭo mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca: the Lord is situated in everyone’s heart, giving dictation according to the attitude of the servant….” (SB.7.5.12.Purport )
Because the devotees of the Lord never wilfully commit any sinful act, but sometimes they can make some mistake. Then they may correct that.
This real issue is “Why is Madhu Pandit harassing innocent devotees?” This question is being avoided. there is no other issue. everything else is a distraction from the fact that Madhu Pandit is harassing devotees.
Hari Bol prabhus.
I saw the comment by MPP. Here he is writing about High Court issue but before that there is so much complains about AP Jaipur devotees misconduct, he did not reply once. WHY ??
And that comment is also not directly but through somebody else !! Why he is hiding himself like this ?
Atleast in devotee forum one should come straight forward.
Just a food for thought.
Yours Servant
Bhakta John
annay mouse:Mahesh Raja says that they want the money from donors that Jaipur has cultivated.
Mahesh: Do NOT TWIST what I have said. HERE is what I EXACTLY said:
25. May 2014 at 1:11 am
Ram Bhakta Das: Bangalore property belongs to a trust owned by MPP’s family members and not the branch of Iskcon. Now this high court order has been challenged by MPP in the Supreme court where the decision is awaiting.
Mahesh: We all know that there is a BIG issue in terms of Prabhupadanugas in Jaipur because there are at least 3 temples fighting for a SMALL percentage of donors. And each one wants to say they are the best. So naturally there has been tension between them—and they speak against one another. Some one says Madhu Pandit is this another say something diffferent etc etc etc.
annay mouse:Secondly, Mahesh says it is a fact that High Court Judges are bribed, can he shows us an example where a high court Judge was convicted of taking a bribe?
Mahesh: Things that happen in India where corruption is SO HIGH are you saying they will ADMIT to being corrupt? This is HOW they play the game. Are you so IGNORANT of news in India: Graft cases, Telecom BILLIONS siphoned off, Coal Mining, BIG Swiss Bank accounts with BILLIONS hidden , Bofors, Italian Helicopter deal, etc etc etc. You think that they are going ADMIT being corrupt?
Aside from the that, WHY is Bombay ISKCON want to TAKE OVER Madhu Pandits Bangalore temple since Srila Prabhupada’s instruction is: DO NOT CENTRALIZE ANYTHING. EACH TEMPLE MUST REMAIN INDEPENDENT AND SELF-SUFFICIENT
72-12-22. Letter: Karandhara
Regarding your points about taxation, corporate status, etc., I have heard from Jayatirtha you want to make big plan for centralization of management, taxes, monies, corporate status, bookkeeping, credit, like that. I do not at all approve of such plan. DO NOT CENTRALIZE ANYTHING. EACH TEMPLE MUST REMAIN INDEPENDENT AND SELF-SUFFICIENT. That was my plan from the very beginning, why you are thinking otherwise? Once before you wanted to do something centralizing with your GBC meeting, and if I did not interfere the whole thing would have been killed. DO NOT THINK IN THIS WAY OF BIG CORPORATION, BIG CREDITS, CENTRALIZATION–THESE ARE ALL NONSENSE PROPOSALS. ONLY THING I WANTED WAS THAT BOOKS PRINTING AND DISTRIBUTION SHOULD BE CENTRALIZED, THEREFORE I APPOINTED YOU AND BALI MARDAN TO DO IT. OTHERWISE, MANAGEMENT, EVERYTHING, SHOULD BE DONE LOCALLY BY LOCAL MEN. ACCOUNTS MUST BE KEPT, THINGS MUST BE IN ORDER AND LAWFULLY DONE, BUT THAT SHOULD BE EACH TEMPLE’S CONCERN, NOT YOURS. KRISHNA CONSCIOUSNESS MOVEMENT IS FOR TRAINING MEN TO BE INDEPENDENTLY THOUGHTFUL AND COMPETENT IN ALL TYPES OF DEPARTMENTS OF KNOWLEDGE AND ACTION, NOT FOR MAKING BUREAUCRACY. ONCE THERE IS BUREAUCRACY THE WHOLE THING WILL BE SPOILED. THERE MUST BE ALWAYS INDIVIDUAL STRIVING AND WORK AND RESPONSIBILITY, COMPETITIVE SPIRIT, NOT THAT ONE SHALL DOMINATE AND DISTRIBUTE BENEFITS TO THE OTHERS AND THEY DO NOTHING BUT BEG FROM YOU AND YOU PROVIDE. NO. NEVER MIND THERE MAY BE BOTHERATION TO REGISTER EACH CENTRE, TAKE TAX CERTIFICATE EACH, BECOME SEPARATE CORPORATIONS IN EACH STATE. THAT WILL TRAIN MEN HOW TO DO THESE THINGS, AND THEY SHALL DEVELOP RELIABILITY AND RESPONSIBILITY, THAT IS THE POINT. I am little observing now, especially in your country, that our men are losing their enthusiasm for spreading on our programmes of Krishna Consciousness movement. Otherwise, why so many letters of problems are coming, dissatisfied? That is not a very good sign. The whole problem is they are not following the regulative principles, that I can detect. Without this, enthusiasm will be lacking. Even mechanically following, and if he gets gradually understanding from the class, he will come to the point of spontaneous enthusiasm. This spontaneous loving devotional service is not so easy matter, but if one simply sticks strictly to the rules and regulations, like rising early, chanting 16 rounds, chanting gayatri, keeping always clean–then his enthusiasm will grow more and more, and if there is also patience and determination, one day he will come to the platform of spontaneous devotion, then his life will be perfect. All of this I have told you in Nectar of Devotion. So I do not think the leaders are themselves following, nor they are seeing the others are following strictly. That must be rectified at once. EACH CENTRE REMAIN INDEPENDENT, THAT’S ALL RIGHT, BUT THE PRESIDENT AND OTHER OFFICERS MUST THEMSELVES FOLLOW AND SEE THE OTHERS ARE FOLLOWING THE REGULATIVE PRINCIPLES CAREFULLY, AND GIVING THEM GOOD INSTRUCTION SO THEY MAY UNDERSTAND NICELY WHY THIS TAPASYA IS NECESSARY. And GBC and Sannyasis will travel and see the officers are doing this, and if they observe anything lowering of the standard, they must reform and advise, or if there is some discrepancy I shall remove it. Of course, if new men are coming, they may not be expected immediately to take to our regulative principles cent per cent. Therefore we should not be so anxious to induce them to live in the temple. Anyone who lives in the temple must agree to follow the rules and regulations without fail. So if some new man moves in with us he may become discouraged if he is forced in this way. Therefore let them live outside and become gradually convinced in the class why they should accept some austerity, then they will live with us out of their own accord and follow nicely everything. It is very difficult to give up very quickly so many bad habits as you have got in your country, so educate them gradually, first with chanting, and do not be so much anxious to count up so many numbers of new devotees, if such devotees go away later being too early forced. I want to see a few sincere devotees, not many false devotees or pretenders.
So my point is that the regulative principles must be followed by everyone. Otherwise their enthusiasm dwindles and they again think of sex and become restless, and so many problems are there. There is some symptom of missing the point. The point is to be engaged in doing something for Krishna, never mind what is that job, but being so engaged in doing something very much satisfying to the devotee that he remains always enthusiastic. He will automatically follow the regulative principles because they are part of his occupational duty–by applying them practically as his occupational duty, he realises the happy result of regulative principles. So the future of this Krishna Consciousness movement is very bright, so long the managers remain vigilant that 16 rounds are being chanted by everyone without fail, that they are all rising before four morning, attending mangal arati–our leaders shall be careful not to kill the spirit of enthusiastic service, which is individual and spontaneous and voluntary. They should try always to generate some atmosphere of fresh challenge to the devotees, so that they will agree enthusiastically to rise and meet it. That is the art of management: to draw out spontaneous loving spirit of sacrificing some energy for Krishna. But where are so many expert managers? All of us should become expert managers and preachers. We should not be very much after comforts and become complacent or self-contented. There must be always some tapasya, strictly observing the regulative principles–Krishna Consciousness movement must be always a challenge, a great achievement to be gained by voluntary desire to do it, and that will keep it healthy. So you big managers now try to train up more and more some competent preachers and managers like yourselves. FORGET THIS CENTRALIZING AND BUREAUCRACY.
Note: Bombay ISKCON has not touched Radhanatha’s Temples in Bombay WHY?
My point is there should be COOPERATION between Prabhupadanugas NOT fighting. Both Dayalu Nitaya dasa Prabhu and Madhu Pandit Prabhu have got lots to offer:
1) Dayalu Nitai Prabhu has done much POSITIVE preaching on his side eg attracting MANY FOREIGN DEVOTEES from Russia, USA, UK to take part there. Plus attracting colleges, University students.
2) Madhu Pandit Prabhu has EXCELLENT management skills with SO MANY Temples
WHAT IS the BIG deal when I say Srila Prabhupada wants cooperation? WHY not the BURY the HATCHET EGOS to SERVE Srila Prabhupada by GENUINE COOPERATION:
76-01-05. Letter: Satsvarupa
EVERYTHING SHOULD BE DONE CO-OPERATIVELY. “Our” and “your’s” are material conceptions and have no place in our Krishna Consciousness movement. If the members of our movement are unable to co-operate it will be very difficult to spread the mission of Lord Caitanya.
72-11-18. Letter: Madhumangala
Regarding general state of affairs at Amsterdam temple, I can understand there is some disturbance among you, but that is not to be taken very seriously. Real business is preaching work, and if there is full attention on this matter only, all other businesses will be automatically successful. Fighting amongst ourselves is not at all good, but if our preaching work is neglected, or if we fall down in following the regulative principles such as rising before four, chanting 16 rounds, like that, if these things are not strictly observed then maya will enter and spoil everything. So my best advice to you is to strictly observe these things yourself and be the example so that all others may follow. WE SHOULD NOT CRITICIZE EACH OTHER, AS VAISNAVAS, BECAUSE THERE IS FAULT IN EVERYONE AND WE MAY BE OURSELVES SUBJECT TO CRITICISM. BEST THING IS TO BE ABOVE SUSPICION OURSELVES, THEN IF WE SEE DISCREPANCIES AND MAKE SUGGESTION THE OTHERS WILL AUTOMATICALLY RESPECT AND TAKE ACTION TO RECTIFY THE MATTERS. THAT IS COOPERATION. AND WE MUST EXIST ON SUCH COOPERATION, OTHERWISE THE WHOLE THING IS DOOMED IF WE SIMPLY GO ON FIGHTING OVER SOME SMALL THING. So try to organize things and preach together in this spirit, and that will please me very, very much.
“Guru-mukha-padma-vakya, cittete koriya aikya, ara na koriho mane asa. Don’t think of any nonsense. Simply execute what your guru has said. That is success.”
(28th January, 1977, Room Conversation)
Amar Puri, your question was already addressed here weeks ago in HKC’s reply to your comments (reproduced below), so why are you obsessively focusing only on this minor point (desperately trying to find fault with HKC) yet totally ignoring the actual issue of the serious harassment of HKC devotees by AP/IB which has been going on for last 4-5 years? That is the subject of these two ‘JSFT’ articles (which include many testimonies by devotees who have been directly affected). MPD/IB/AP are also still ignoring this issue. All they have done since these articles were published over a month ago is reproduce the article of lies and distortions by the madman Tim Lee (Puranjana/PADA) on their ISKCON “Truth” and ISKCON Times websites & FaceBook pages (and deleted all the comments that were made there by various devotees). Yet it seems that none of this extremely un-Vaishnava behaviour concerns you in the slightest. It is very obvious that your claims of non-bias and standing for the TRUTH are nonsense. Do you have no shame?
Amar Puri Prabhu :
therefore, using a trade mark of any other establishment without valid permission is considered a CRIME.
HKC devotees :
Prabhu this whole comment is based on this false assumption that HKC has used A.P’s name illegally. Please see the flyer in which HKC has given a section “Appreciation by prominent personalities” in which there are comments by Gauridas Pandit Prabhu, Madhu Pandit Prabhu (Chairman, Akshay Patra), Dr. Swarankar (CMD – Mahatama Gandhi Medical University), Mr. S.R. Meel (MD – SKIT group of colleges) appreciating the preaching work of HKC.
Does this mean that we have used SKIT’s name (one of the biggest group of Engg. Colleges), Mahatma Gandhi Medical University’s name (a very big name in Medical field) illegally??? Does it mean that we are posing SKIT, MGMC or A.P??? It is simply saying that the heads of these organizations are praising HKC which is true as all these personalities including MPP have actually written these comments to us. None of the other personalities are complaining except MPP. In fact these heads of SKIT or MGMC who are not devotees in normal estimation are very happy if their comments can give some benefit to our preaching activities. Only MPP is unhappy about it. In the first place why did MPP give this comment in writing which he does not want others to know??? Why this duplicit behavior??? What harm can this comment do to MPP or A.P??? This comment could have helped HKC to counteract the bad propaganda by A.P Jaipur devotees but MPP wrote some instigating mails after this which made the situation here worse. What is MPP’s problem??? Is this not Srila Prabhupada’s movement ? In fact MPP’s angry response in not wanting to use this simple 2 line of appreciation by HKC is very surprising!!!
Amar Puri Prabhu :
As you admitted that you did use the Trade mark of AP and a personal name of MMP without valid permission IN HAND which has created the whole MESS and MISUNDERSTANDING
HKC devotees :
First of all there is no misunderstanding here. It is very clear to everyone (you can go through the open letter of Dayalu Nitai Prabhu to MPP and CPP once more) that A.P, Jaipur devotees have been calling HKC bogus etc. after Dayalu Nitai Prabhu showed reluctance to close his centre and move to some other city which was proposed by IB GBC after they got established in Jaipur. For your kind information HKC was already preaching from before and having their centre and A.P came to Jaipur much later. It is also clear to all of us that MPP, CPP and other IB GBC know about it since Dayalu Prabhu had been writing mails to MPP with a CC to all these GBC men.
In fact this incident of printing MPP’s favorable comment has solved this misunderstanding on our part that MPP/CPP will judge this situation impartially without the feelings of “me and mine” and rectify this problem. After this incident MPP started using words like “full scale war” and instead of finding a peaceful solution , started instigating these A.P, Jaipur devotees who increased their attacks after the approval of their leader. Dayalu Nitai Prabhu was telling MPP that why is he making a big issue out of this incident and not referring to the main issue wherein his A.P, Jaipur devotees are trying to crush Srila Prabhupada’s movement going on here. But there was no response, infact he wrote to Dayalu Prabhu not to write any more mails to him. Now it is very clear to us that MPP, CPP never wanted to stop this and they were being nice nice to us while on the back this bad propaganda was continuing. We were very naïve and took too much time to realize that actually their silence meant approval.
Dear HKC Devotees,
Dear Amar Puri prabhu,
Please accept our humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
We could not reply to your comment due to some very pressing services going on here. Since the number of children in our Gurukula and the number of cows in our Goshala have increased substantially in the last few months, we are forced to speed up our construction work in Hare Krishna Village which is 70 Km from Jaipur where our goshala and gurukula will be shifting very soon. Currently the goshala and gurukula is being maintained in the city which is proving to be very costly ,so all the devotees here are on a marathon to create enough facility for them in HKV. Please refer to the below links to see the activities of devotees going on to develop Hare Krishna Village:
https://www.facebook.com/HareKrishnaVillage
https://www.facebook.com/bigvc123.jaipur
Please accept my humble obeisances to all of you. AGTSP.
Thank you for your kind reply. It seems that you are replying to my comments on behalf of HG. Dayalu Nitai Das Prabhu who is certainly aware of what you are writing in replying to my comments.
I am Raghav Pandit Das, Secretary of HKC, Jaipur and I am replying not only on behalf of Dayalu Nitai prabhu but on behalf of all the devotees of HKC, Jaipur who have been tolerating the ill treatment of AP, Jaipur since last 5 years. In my replies I have copied some portions from the open letter of Dayalu Nitai prabhu to MPP and CPP which was published on this site, since this letter has been written after lot of deliberation with solid evidences.
After reading carefully, I find that there are various link missing in HKC devotees’ writing which I am addressing here below for further clarifications ;
HKC devotees : ” ……….There was no reply to this proposal and instead A.P Jaipur took the stand of calling HKC bogus and telling everyone that I am demanding some post etc. so I was removed from A.P and decided to continue their show separately. ”
Who ( authoritative personal of AP ) took the stand of calling HKC as bogus ?
This stand was taken not by one or two devotees but as a policy by Ratnagada Das (President, AP Jaipur), Anantshesh Das (Vice-President, AP Jaipur) and many full time brahmacaris like Madhav Charan Das, Anantvirya Das, Sanat Das etc. etc. If you ask for proof we can reproduce portions of some mails written by Dayalu Nitai prabhu to MPP many years back:
From : Dharmesh Sharma To : mpd@iskconbangalore.org
Cc: cpd@iskconbangalore.org, aad@iskconbangalore.org, Nimai Pandit Das, rgovindasa@yahoo.com, anantha_sesha@yahoo.co.in
Date: 7th May 2010.
Before getting into the details of what is happening here I will like to humbly submit to you that the purpose of writing this mail is just to prevent creating friction in Srila Prabhupada’s movement. I am sure you will see this mail in that light.
First of all I would like to state the latest incident which happened few days back here. One boy by the name of Avinash Jangir was staying near Hare Krishna centre in Nirman Nagar with his parents for last 3-4 years. After completing his schooling he joined SKIT (an Engg. College in Sitapura – a place which is 20 kms. from our centre) and was associating with devotees here. Gradually he started coming regularly for the morning sadhana and started getting more and more involved in Srila Prabhupada’s service. He started living in the centre and wanted to pursue BA (in philosophy) instead of BE as it was becoming very difficult for him to cope up with his Engg. Studies. As usual there was lot of opposition from his parents. Finally his father shifted him to a place near his college.
Since the place where he is currently staying is near Akshaya Patra and he was having lot of difficulty with his sadhana I told him that he should associate with devotees at Akshaya Patra to get spiritual strength. He started visiting Akshaya Patra for the morning program and was also taking prasadam there. When the devotees there realized that he used to earlier visit Hare Krishna Centre and now also goes there sometimes they started saying false things to him about me. Some of the statements made by devotees at Akshaya Patra, Jaipur are as follows –
“Do not go there, they are not following Srila Prabhupada. Dayalu Nitai criticizes MPP & CPP . Do not associate with him , he is preaching independently …Srila Prabhupada has not recommended this type of preaching …he is after name fame etc. etc.”
Like that there are many many other incidents which we have been repeatedly raising with MPP since last five years. Please mention your e-mail id and I will send you all the material which you can study and it will help you to judge the situation impartially. Prabhu where are you physically located ? If you could come to Jaipur and stay with us for sometime it will help you to understand the situation more clearly.
Who fabricated this lie that HG DND Prabhu was removed from AP when he never had any link with AP ? Is there any such proof to establish the TRUTH ?
There are not one but hundreds of students who were preached by Dayalu Nitai prabhu but after visiting AP Jaipur most of them stopped coming to HKC and started showing very inimical behavior towards Dayalu Nitai prabhu. Some of them who realized their mistake later on told us that how they were misguided by AP devotees who were twisting the facts to prove that Dayalu Nitai prabhu asked for a post etc. Dayalu Nitai prabhu has explained about this twisting of his mail to MPP written many years back in his open letter in para 11, 12, 13, please refer to that.
I am also attaching a link to an audio file which is a conversation between Madhav Charan Das (Youth preacher of AP, Jaipur) and a new student who is asking him about HKC and Dayalu Nitai prabhu’s preaching programs, in reply Madhav Charan Das is openly telling him not to associate with devotees of HKC.When asked by that student Abhimanyu as to why he should not associate with HKC, Madhav Charan Das is explaining since HKC is not under their GBC they are unauthorized and bogus. Madhav Charan Das is also telling in this audio file the false story of Dayalu Nitai prabhu asking for post etc.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlwvl7mtlkmov8m/1%20madhavcharan%20to%20abhimanyu.amr
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ghzmi5h4zn2vrux/1%20madhavcharan%20to%20abhimanyu_low.mp3
Can you imagine Madhav Charan Das is not stopping here but telling that student to propagate this to other students also !!! This conversation happened before the incident of printing MPP’s comment by HKC.
HKC devotees : ” ……… appreciating the preaching work of HKC. ”
Knowing very well that HKC devotees have ISSUES and concerns with HG MMP and AP. , then why would some body with the right mind use such appreciation or endorsement some sort IF the PERMISSION is not given in writing to advertise it ? That is THE PROBLEM itself. That is why it appears as CRIMINAL which created a MESS and further MISUNDERSTANDING in relation with HG MMP and AP. Isn’t it ?
Did HKC devotees have any sort of ISSUES or concerns with various establishments who appreciated the HKC work ? It does not look like from the Truth presented in the article. Therefore, HKC devotees are/were FREE from any allegation from those establishments. Is this not a FACT ?
Please refer to http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=41392#comment-26560 para no. 1, 2, 3 Where this point has been explained in detail by Dayalu Nitai prabhu. If you will note MPP has written that we can publish his comment as ISKCON leader but not as Chairman Akshay Patra but since the comment had already gone by the time his mail was received we could not correct this small “mistake”.
By the way this negative propaganda by AP Jaipur devotees and MPP’s , CPP’s silence over it has nothing to do with this incident which happened few months back.
And as far as the question that why MPP would appreciate HKC has been already answered in our reply to your previous comment, we are reproducing that reply again for your reference:
“In fact this incident of printing MPP’s favorable comment has solved this misunderstanding on our part that MPP/CPP will judge this situation impartially without the feelings of “me and mine” and rectify this problem. After this incident MPP started using words like “full scale war” and instead of finding a peaceful solution , started instigating these A.P, Jaipur devotees who increased their attacks after the approval of their leader. Dayalu Nitai Prabhu was telling MPP that why is he making a big issue out of this incident and not referring to the main issue wherein his A.P, Jaipur devotees are trying to crush Srila Prabhupada’s movement going on here. But there was no response, infact he wrote to Dayalu Prabhu not to write any more mails to him. Now it is very clear to us that MPP, CPP never wanted to stop this and they were being nice nice to us while on the back this bad propaganda was continuing. We were very naïve and took too much time to realize that actually their silence meant approval.”
Since there was no mistake from HKC devotees MPP/CPP could not come out openly against us while the other devotees at A.P, Jaipur were continuing to blaspheme us. MPP took this small ‘mistake’ of not asking his approval to print his comment as an excuse to declare “full scale war” against HKC. If MPP does not want the others to know that he has appreciated our work then why did he write these lines of appreciation??? Why this duplicity??? A devotee should be straight forward in his dealings.
Further HKC devotees write in replying to my question ;
Amar Puri Prabhu :
despite the fact that you are having success in your own endeavour to establish your preaching program in the service of Srila Prabhupada at WHAT COST when you at least come to think about it in the mode of Satva Guna ?
HKC devotees :
After reading the above carefully please tell us what is the definition of Sattva Guna and in which Guna MPP is operating?
SATTVA Guna represents NO Hankering and NO Lamentation for a personal satisfaction.
Are HG MPP, AP and HG DND, HKC devotees freely operating from personal satisfaction without hankering and lamentation ?
We are all trying to serve Srila Prabhupada selflessly with all our anarthas as far as possible, I do not know how to prove this, best would be if you could come and stay with us and guide us to become more surrendered to Srila Prabhupada. If we can benefit by your association we will be very happy.
The Choice is Individual to choose from the above either to accept it or reject it.
Should both the sides reach to an amicable resolution FREELY OPERATING FROM PERSONAL SATISFACTION WITHOUT HANKERING AND LAMENTATION simply and purely in the service of the mission of our Jagat Gauru Srila Prabhupada, there would have no PROBLEM at all.
Is it not TRUE ?
NO, IT’S NOT TRUE. There have been many instances where some devotees are trying to serve selflessly but out of envy the others are putting obstacles in their path. Though we are not comparing ourselves with Srila Prabhupada in front of whom we are insignificant ants but we can certainly cite his example wherein his godbrothers created so much trouble for him , does it mean that this problem happened because both sides had false motives. One place Srila Prabhupada writes “All along my godbrothers gave me only depression, repression, compression—but I continued strong in my duty.”
HKC devotees : ” …….. raising this issue in public.This was around March 2014 (2 months back).”
Why did HKC devotees not raise this conflicting ISSUE earlier in the public forum such as this web site or other as it has been the problem since 2008 — till March 2014 ?
We have replied to this point to you in our earlier comment. I am again reproducing that for your information:
1) First we tolerated and ignored all the injustices being done by A.P Jaipur thinking that it will stop in due course and continued our positive preaching.This was approx.. from 2008-09.
2) When things were not stopping but instead increasing we first approached Ratnagada (T.P, A.P, Jaipur). This was around 2010-11
3) When Ratnagada told us that you do your preaching and we do our preaching but the bad propaganda still did not stop then we approached senior devotees like MPP, CPP and other IB GBC members. This was around 2011-12
4) When there were only assurances but no action from them for a long time then we started writing stronger mails to them. This was around 2012-13
5) When MPP closed all doors for talks and declared “full scale war” on the plea of this trivial issue of printing his simple 2 line appreciation sent by him to Dayalu Nitai Prabhu, we wrote one final mail to CPP to give us some concrete date for meeting otherwise we will have to come in public. This was around 2014.
6)Even after this when there was no response then we decided to appeal to other Prabhupadanuga devotees to intervene and also started raising this issue in public.This was around March 2014 (2 months back).
Please send us if there could have been a better approach by HKC devotees which would please Srila Prabhupada more.
HKC devotees : ” It is very clear from the above statements who is ethical and who is unethical. …………. ”
What is ethical ? Serving selflessly free from any Profit i.e. personal satisfaction, Adoration and
Distinction etc. in the service of our Jagat Guru Srila Prabhupada’s mission is considered ethical whereas other motive is considered unethical depending upon the influence of the three modes of material nature at Gross and Subtle sphere.
HKC devotees : ” Prabhu , at this point I can just remember one quote of Srila Prabhupada “calling a thief a thief is certainly not wrong but calling an honest man a thief is very detrimental to one making progress in spiritual life.”
So who is calling an HONEST MAN a thief as explained above ? Where is the need to support UNTRUTH ?
HKC devotees : ” Prabhu, pleases study all the events carefully and give your impartial judgment that will be very pleasing to Srila Prabhupada. Supporting untruth, talking untruth will certainly bear bad reactions in our life and may cause so many offences. ”
Dear Devotees of Srila Prabhupada by asking my IMPARTIAL JUDGEMENT pleasing to Srila Prabhupada under this very SELF DESTRUCTIVE CONFLICT presented here in this public forum, I beg from both the sides to get together in order to resolve their differences SELFLESSLY WITHOUT HANKERING AND LAMENTATION simply and purely in the service of the mission of our Jagat Gauru Srila Prabhupada.
Prabhu, we also agree with you that we should move towards a solution and we think the best thing would be “both the sides to get together in order to resolve their differences” as suggested by you. This is what we have been trying since so many years but the A.P devotees are avoiding this Ishtagoshti, Can you help us to organize an Isthagoshti ?
Also, I beg from HG DND to withdraw all the USELESS — UNPRODUCTIVE allegations presented with or without relative TRUTH as it seems in the article -1 and 2 without any finger pointing at each other as I have humbly submitted in my comments.
I beg to differ from you at this point. All the points raised in the open letter are simply truth with evidences and logic. Everyone has a right to protect himself. As Srila Prabupada says “”Prabhupada: So what they are going to answer to this? Will you accept everything? Ask them. So when the (indistinct), but exposes you, what answer you have got? Why you are silent? Silent means acceptance. Maunam (indistinct). If I say, “You are rascal, you are thief,” and if you don’t reply that means you accept it. Maunam (indistinct). If you do not protest, and if you do not say anything, so such a big criticism from (indistinct) and they are silent. Why do they not go to the court? Bluff (indistinct). That means he accepts.” >>> Ref. VedaBase => Morning Walk — December 28, 1976, Bombay”
After exhausting all other peaceful means we are coming in public forum which is proving to be very USEFUL and PRODUCTIVE. Because after reading these articles many devotees are coming to know about the TRUTH which is helping them to decide which association to seek. After these articles the negative propaganda of AP Jaipur has reduced (at least for the time being) since many students and donors, equipped with truth, are asking various questions to AP Jaipur devotees which they are not able to answer.
After all, we are all CONDITIONED souls trying to best serve the mission of our Jagat Guru Srila Prabhupada.
Selfless serving the Spiritual Mission of the Lord Shri Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu free from all material desires is the only way to please our Jagat Guru HDG. Srila Prabhupada.
We have tried our best to present the facts as it is. Since all of us have lots of services to serve Srila Prabhupada we cannot do more than this to answer your queries. If you still have doubts and desire to be an impartial judge then we can only invite you to stay with us and get first hand experience and observation and we can also send lot of more material for you to study in order to understand the situation here.
OM TAT SAT.
Hari BOL. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada.
In conclusion we would request you to help us to move towards a solution which is organizing an Ishtagoshti where all these issues can be discussed and resolved in the larger interest of expanding Srila Prabhupada’s mission. One way would be that you can appeal to MPP to hold an istagosthi with HKC devotees. Would you do that ?
YS……. Amar Puri.
Your servants,
HKC devotees
webmaster: more comments can be found at article Part II:
JAIPUR STRUGGLE FOR TRUTH – II