REFUTATION OF THE RUPANUGA DASA INTERPRETATION OF OCTOBER 18, 1977 CONVERSATION WITH SRILA PRABHUPADA

Any opinion different from the opinion of the spiritual master is useless. One cannot
infiltrate materially concocted ideas into spiritual advancement. That is deviation. 
(CC Adi 12.9 Purport)

RUPANUGA VADA KHANDANA – PART 1 –
REFUTATION OF THE RUPANUGA DASA INTERPRETATION OF OCTOBER 18, 1977 CONVERSATION WITH SRILA PRABHUPADA

REPLY TO RUPANUGA DASA
by Yasoda nandana dasa 

Actual text of conversation with Srila Prabhupada in his room, October 18, 1977, Vrndavana, India

Srila Prabhupāda: So, you are taking care of that conveyance?
Tamāla Krnsa: Yes, we are, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Jayapatākā: Because you are a paramahamsa, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you are seeing everyone else as surrendered to Krsna. But only by your mercy, you are forcing us to serve Krsna.
Srila Prabhupāda: Hare Krsna. One Bengali gentleman has come from New York?
Tamāla Krsna: Yes. Mr. Sukamal Roy Chowdury.
Srila Prabhupāda: So I have deputed some of you to initiate. Hm?
Tamāla Krsna: Yes. Actually… Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Srila Prabhupāda: So I think Jayapatākā can do that if he likes. I have already deputed. Tell him.
Tamāla Krsna: Yes.
Srila Prabhupāda: So, deputies, Jayapatākā’s name was there?
Bhagavān: It is already on there, Śrīla Prabhupāda. His name was on that list.
Srila Prabhupāda: So I depute him to do this at Māyāpura, and you may go with him. I stop for the time being. Is that all right?
Tamāla Krsna: Stopped doing what, Śrīla Prabhupāda?
Srila Prabhupāda: This initiation. I have deputed the, my disciples. Is it clear or not?
Girirāja: It’s clear.
Srila Prabhupāda: You have got the list of the names?

Tamāla Krsna: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Srila Prabhupāda: And if by Krsna’s grace I recover from this condition, then I shall begin again, or I may not be pressed in this condition to initiate. It is not good.
Girirāja: We will explain to him so that he will understand properly.
Srila Prabhupāda: Hm? Hm?
Girirāja: I said we will explain to the Bengali gentleman just as you have described to us, so that he’ll be satisfied with this arrangement.
Srila Prabhupāda: And Dr. Ghosh has his scheme, but actually the scheme is there in the Bhagavad-gītā and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. We want to introduce that scheme to our Gurukula. We haven’t got to manufacture scheme. Is that correct?
Girirāja: Yes.
Srila Prabhupāda: Let them learn to rise early in the morning and cleanse. This is the first scheme. This will keep their health nice. Cātur-varnyam mayā srstam [Bhagavad Gita. 4.13]. Unless in the human society the varnāśrama system is introduced, no scheme or social order, health order or any order, political order, will be successful.
Bhagavān: Everything is there very clearly in your books, Śrīla Prabhupāda.
Srila Prabhupāda: A man-made scheme-useless. Sāttvika-yuga.(?) What is that verse? Sattvāvalambi-para-sattva-viśuddha-sattvam… From Brahma-samhitā?

Rupanuga dasa statement: A Bengali gentleman has come from New York seeking initiation from Srila Prabhupada.  But Srila Prabhupada has already deputed his ritvik acaryas and he thinks Jayapataka should do the initiation.

Note:  Srila Prabhupada has not specifically told anyone to be a diksa-guru, only to act as officiating representative as per his July 9th letter.  Srila Prabhupada is only reconfirming what he had already established in his earlier directive of July 9th 1977 letter.

Rupanuga dasa statement:  The key sentences here are not the ones containing the word “depute,” but rather the following:  “I stop for the time being,”  “And if by Krsna’s grace I recover from this condition, then I shall begin again.”

Note: Classic word jugglery. After Srila Prabhupada has emphasized the word deputee in five different grammatical combinations, we are now being informed that this not the key point.

Srila Prabhupada’s emphasis is not only three times, but five times.

It is common understanding that in Vedic literatures, to emphasize an important point, it is done three times. 

Srila Prabhupada says:   “anything is uttered three times—“do it, do it, do it”—one should understand that this is meant to indicate great stress on a fact…”  Srimad-Bhagavatam  10.9.20:

This verse repeats the word ‘eva’ [‘certainly’] three times for emphasis, and it also three times repeats ‘harer nāma’ [‘the holy name of the Lord’], just to make common people understand.

PURPORT

To emphasize something to an ordinary person, one may repeat iit three times, just as one might say, “You must do this! You must do this! You must do this!  Sri Caitanya-caritamrta (Unrevised original edition) Adi-Lila 17.23

“This verse repeats the word ‘eva’ [‘certainly’] three times for emphasis, and it also three times repeats ‘harer nāma’ [‘the holy name of the Lord’], just to make common people understand.

Srila Prabhupada:  “…The Vedic literature, for emphasis, clearly states three times that in this age of Kali—kalau nāsty eva nāsty eva nāsty eva—there is no other alternative, no other alternative, no other alternative than harer nāma   Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.21.6

Note: Srila Prabhupada uses the word deputy five times referring to his prior nomination on July 9th 1977 of 11 officiating representatives to carry initiations on his behalf.
11 chosen devotees were only officiating representatives.

 Srila Prabhupada’s repeated use of the word deputee five times is the key point of this conversation.

Rupanuga dasa’s statement:

“And if by Krsna’s grace I recover from this condition, then I shall begin again.”  “I stop for the time being” indicates that the ritvik appointments made three months earlier were necessary due to Srila Prabhupada’s condition, but he considered them temporary—to last until his own initiations could begin again.  In other words, “for the time being” indicates Srila Prabhupada’s expectation of taking up initiations again in due course.  “And if by Krsna’s grace I recover from this condition, then I shall begin again,” indicates his hopeful intention to take up initiation duties again in the future.

Notes: More speculative interpretation.  Nowhere did Srila Prabhupada has ever said that the following: ”the ritvik appointments made three months earlier were necessary due to Srila Prabhupada’s condition, but he considered them temporary” In other words, “for the time being” indicates Srila Prabhupada’s expectation of taking up initiations again in due course.

Fact: it is well known that Srila Prabhupada;’s health at that time was not in the best condition.  Although he is always fully transcendental and above the modes of nature, he had been bed ridden for several months, and his health had been deteriorating.

Fact: July 9th 1977.  Srila Prabhupada had put in place an officiating representative system by his letter of July 1977.  And he again reconfirmed his original intention of setting up an officiating representative system.   

Fact: July 19th 1977.

Srila Prabhupāda: So let us artificial activity. I think this is a nice arrangement.
Devotee:  Upendra and I could see it for the last… [break]
Srila Prabhupāda: And nobody is going to disturb you there. Make your own field and continue to become rttvik and act on my charge. People are becoming sympathetic there. The place is very nice.
Devotee:  Yeah. He says, “The introduction of Bhagavad-gītā has been translated into Tamil, and I will have the second chapter done next. Then publish a small booklet for immediate distribution.”
Srila Prabhupāda: Very good.  (Srila Prabhupada Room Conversation, July 19, 1977, Vrndavana, India.)

Srila Prabhupada is only indicating that his health is not good enough to carry on the ceremonials of the fire sacrifice etc. and that his deputies can do this on behalf, initiating his disciples by acting as his deputee representatives.

Srila Prabhupada was still and is still giving divyam-jnanam, the essence of diksa, and accepting disciples. All he is asking his disciples to do in this conversation is for his deputees, officiating representatives is to take up the process of (i) chosing the names of the new initiate; (ii) chanting on the japa beads on behalf of Srila Prabhupada; (iii) perform the fire sacrifice of the initiation on his behalf.

Srila Prabhupada always used specific terminology.

–There is no mistake in Srila Prabhupada’s  rhetorical arrangements.

Sri Caitanya-Caitamta says:
“Mistakes, illusions, cheating and defective perception do not occur in the sayings of the authoritative sages.

Purport
…But there cannot be mistakes, illusion, cheating or imperfect perception in the words of liberated sages… Śrīla Vyāsadeva revealed these statements after perfect realization, and therefore they are perfect, for liberated sages like Vyāsadeva never commit errors in their rhetorical arrangements… Sri Caitanya-caritamrta  (Unrevised 1975 edition- 1975 Adi-lila 2.86

–Srila Prabhupada’s direction is the same s Krsna’s direction.

Srila Prabhupada says: “… The spiritual master  is the representative of the Supreme Lord, his direction is directly the direction of the Supreme Lord…” Bhagavad-gita As It Is,  (Unrevised 1972 edition) 10.3.

– Srila Prabhupada never contradicts himself.

Srila Prabhupāda: Yes. So contradiction means imperfect knowledge. Perfect knowledge means who sticks to his principles. That is perfect knowledge. One who does not stick to his original proposal, his knowledge is imperfect.    Philosophy Discussions: Discussions with Syamasundara dasa: Gottfried Wilhelm von Leibnitz

Note:If Srila Prabhupada had intended for his disciples to be full-fledged diksa-gurus by this conversation, why did he not use the specific words “diksa-guru” or acarya?  He only used the word deputee. He was precise, and simply reconfirmed the last previous statement he had made on July 19, 1977:  “continue to become a ritvik and act on my charge”.

Srila Prabhupada does not use the word (i) diksa-guru, (ii) successor guru, (ii) zonal guru, (iv) appointed guru, etc, he clearly uses the word deputy to emphasize that these 11 chosen devotees were only officiating representatives.

If Srila Prabhupada had intended to amend, modify, change, supplement or reverse his written directive (His “Final Order”) of July 9, 1977, “these representatives may accept the devotee as an initiated disciple of Srila Prabhupada… the newly initiated devotees are disciples of His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada” and his reconfirmation on July 19, 1977 “continue to become a ritvik and act on my charge”, why did He not use the specific words diksa-guru or appointed guru, or successor guru or acarya?

List of names.

Srila Prabhupāda: You have got the list of the names?
Tamāla Krsna: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda

Rupanuga dasa conveniently avoids one of the most important point in this whole conversation:  the list of names.

Note: And what is that list? The July 9th 1977 written directive approved by Srila Prabhupada, specifying the direct capacity in which the officiating representatives were to continue the officiating service to be done on His behalf.

• Srila Prabhupada designated these 11 devotees to act as ritviks and did not indicate that after his departure they would be empowered to act as guru-acharyas, it must be accepted that ritvik representative was the authority he saw them fit to handle
• His last written words were “act as rittvik representative of the acarya”.  That is His order, his arrangement for continuation of the disciplic succession.
• It has now become a fashion for the members and supporters of the self-appointed acarya party to quote Srila Prabhupada to contradict and defy Srila Prabhupada.
• Srila Prabhupada made his intentions and directions very clear in His directives of July 9 and July 19th 1977.  There is no need for new interpretations.

“…I have selected you among eleven men as ‘rittvik‘ or representative of the acharya.” (July 10th)
“…the process for initiation to be followed in the future.” (July 11th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my charge.” (July 19th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my behalf.” (July 31th)

A few historical notes.

Outside advice?

Rupanuga dasa and the GBC went to seek outside advice and clarification from Gaudiya Matha advisors in 1978.

Srila Prabhupada differs:
“You should not give attention to any outsider’s advice because they are completely unfit to give you advice..”   SPLSunday, March 9, 1969

” There is no need whatsoever for outside instruction.” SPL to Gurukrpa and Yasoda nandana dasa, December 1973

“… he never recommended anyone to be acarya of the Gaudiya Math. But Sridhara Maharaja is responsible for disobeying this order of Guru Maharaja, and he and others who are already dead unnecessarily thought that there must be one acarya . If Guru Maharaja could have seen someone who was qualified at that time to be acarya he would have mentioned…”

“…So Sridhara Maharaja and his two associate gentlemen unauthorizedly selected one acarya and later it proved a failure. The result is now everyone is claiming to be acarya  even though they may be kanistha adhikari with no ability to preach. In some of the camps the acarya is being changed three times a year. Therefore, we may not commit the same mistake in our ISKCON camp. Actually, amongst my Godbrothers no one is qualified to become acarya…”

So, Sridhar Maharaja was responsible for disobeying…
“We shall not make the same mistake in our ISKCON camp…
” They [Gaudiya matha] are very competent to harm our natural progress” SP to Rupanuga dasa, April 1974

“…I have also read specifically your articles on the matter of acaryas, wherein on the 14th Paragraph I see the acharya shall be entitled to nominate in writing his successive acharya. But we do not find any record where our Srila Prabhupada nominated any acharya after Him. Different persons have interpreted on this point, and every one of our Godbrothers are acting as acharya, so this is a controversial point which I do not wish to enter into while we are proposing for cooperation …” (August: Letter to: Swami B. S. Bhagavata Maharaja — Los Angeles 21 August, 19)

So where is the record of the so-called acarya appointment allegedly done by Srila Prabhupada and propagated by Rupanuga das and the GBC in 1978?

Clear as Mud?

Fact:  The GBC and Rupanuga went to the Gaudiya Matha Nabadvipa advisor in March of 1978 to seek advice and clarification about the guru issue and how it should be implemented in ISKCON.

Rupanuga dasa, in knowledge of the above-referenced clear warnings by Srila Prabhupada, did not warn and alert devotees and the leaders of ISKCON about Srila Prabhupada’s prophetic letter. He went right along with the concocted acarya appointment. But now he wants all of us to believe that he understood Srila Prabhupada’s real intentions in October of 1977!  Why did Rupanuga dasa and the GBC go to the Gaudiya Matha advisor, for clarification for something they now claim they had understood all along?  

If, according to Rupanuga dasa and company, everything was so clear to them in October of 1978, as per the following conversation:   Srila Prabhupāda: This initiation. I have deputed the, my disciples. Is it clear or not? Giirirāja: It’s clear, then why did they jump to Nabadvipa to seek clarification from an outside advisor to seek clarification of Srila Prabhupada’s instructions?    How did everything become so unclear within just a few months that they felt that had to go to the Gaudiya Matha advisor to seek clarification? Another unresolved mystery!

Convenient Amnesia.

Srila Prabhupada had already warned Rupanuga dasa about the history of the Gaudiya Matha in April of 1974. Had Rupanuga dasa conveniently forgotten the April 28, 1974 personal letter from Srila Prabhupada and His warnings about Sridhar Maharaja’s role in destroying the Gaudiya Matha and their unauthorized acarya appointment?

Consultation with Higher Authorities?

Further, in March of 1978, at the Mayapur festival, Rupanuga dasa and the GBC issued a position paper to explain the process of future initiations for ISKCON. Under the title of the position paper was placed “In Consultation with Higher Authorities”.  So why did Rupanuga dasa and company have to consult with “Higher Authorities” in March of 1978, just a few months after they had allegedly understood Srila Prabhupada’s clear instructions in the matter of initiations in October of 1977? More unresolved mysteries!
And who are these so-called higher authorities?   And when did Srila Prabhupada ever instruct us to go consulting other higher authorities than Him for the conduct of the missionary activities of His movement?

1978 Guru appointment hoax.

Following the Mayapur festival in March of 1978, a worldwide propaganda campaign was orchestrated by Rupanuga dasa and the GBC to attempt to convince the ISKCON devotees that Srila Prabhupada had appointed 11 gurus who were his true successors, that these 11 were pure devotees, uttama adhikaris, and that Srila Prabhupada had personally appointed these pure devotee diksa-gurus in May and July of 1977, as his true successors pure devotees acaryas.

Mythology Revival.

The secretary himself admitted the guru appointment myth in December of 1980 in Topanga Canyon, California. He clearly admitted in a quasi-public forum that the idea that Srila Prabhupada had appointed 11 gurus was a myth and that Srila Prabhupada had never appointed any gurus.

It should be noted that these important conversations with His Divine Grace Srila Prabhupada were not released by the GBC for many years after Srila Prabhupada’s departure. Why not?

This new grammatical jugglery and interpretation is simply another attempt to revive the same old Guru appointment myth in a different format and avoid the order of the acarya Srila Prabhupada.

Srila Prabhupada did not use the word diksa guru, acarya, appointed guru, appointed successor, etc   He was very consistent by use of the word deputee in five different grammatical variations.

Historical facts.

By June of 1977, Srila Prabhupada had already removed himself from the choosing of the names of the new initiates, the chanting on the beads, the performing of the fire sacrifice but he was still the diksa-guru of the new initiates and was to remain the diksa-guru. Sri Prabhupada never gave the order to any of these 11 or 111 disciples to actually be diksa-gurus in the last few months of 1977.  The current Rupanuga dasa interpretation and all of the post 1977 GBC interpretations of these various conversations are simply an attempt at mythology revival and avoiding the order of the acarya, as per his clear directive of July 9th 1977.

When was Srila Prabhupada’s July 9th 1977 order changed or modified by Srila Prabhupada himself? When was the specific order to any of his disciples to be diksa-guru ever given after May 28 1977?

It is a fact that Rupanuga dasa and company’s post 1977 propaganda campaign throughout ISKCON, coupled with the GBC‘s iron fisted approach, conveyed myth and falsehood that the 11 had been appointed by Srila Prabhupada as diksa-gurus?

While it is certainly noble of Rupanuga dasa to enlighten us with his new current interpretation, it should not be forgotten that he was one of the original GBCs who vociferously supported and preached the appointment hoax and myth for many years.

While this new interpretation after 32 years seems to be an interesting pious belief, can he now publicly answer as to when these original 11 were ever appointed or selected by Srilla Prabhupada as diksa-gurus When? Where? How?

Has anything been learned from the post 1936 and post 1977 appointment guru fiasco and the Maha-bhagavata assembly line of the GBC?

Srila Prabhupada had already warned a few months earlier about the dreaded personal ambition disease that destroyed the Gaudiya Matha:

Srila Prabhupada warns about the result of manufacturing?
Result of suppressing Guru.
Result of ambition to take the place of guru.

Srila Prabhupada: We haven’t got to manufacture. To manufacture ideas is troublesome. Why should we take the trouble? And as soon as you want to manufacture something to my…., that is DANGEROUS. ...That you are singing every day, “what our guru has said, that is our life and soul.” …As soon as this POISON will come-suppress guru and I become Brahman-everything FINISHED. Spiritual life is finished. Gaudiya Matha finished, …VIOLATED the orders of Guru Maharaja.  …And as soon as you manufacture, fall down. This manufacturing idea is very, very dangerous in spiritual life. …Our mission is to serve bhakta visesa and live with devotees. NOT THAT YOU TAKE THE PLACE OF GURU. THAT IS NONSENSE, VERY DANGEROUS. Then everything will be spoiled. As soon as you become AMBITIOUS to TAKE THE PLACE of GURU-gurusuh nara matih. That is MATERIAL DISEASE.   April 1977 Bombay, India

Srila Prabhupada’s warning about concocting whimsically.
Srila Prabhupada defines preaching.

“So if you are actually, perfectly carrying out the orders of Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, then you are preaching. Otherwise you will do wrongly, mislead. Don’t do that. Andha yathandhair upaniyamanah . If you remain blind, don’t try to lead other blind men. That is misleading. First of all open your eyes. Everything is there. Nobody can do anything whimsically. If you do whimsically, concoctedly, that will be failure. It will not be effective. (Conversations with Srila Prabhupada, 2 May, 1976, Fiji):

Srila Prabhupada warns about proceeding on the wrong platform.

What will be the result of the wrong platform?
“So, on the wrong platform you may go-go forward more and more-but it will be dismantled, because it is wrong.” Lecture 6-5-74

Srila Prabhupada warns about contradictory philosophy.

DISCIPLE:One day they say one thing. One day they say something else.
PRABHUPADA: That means rascal. Room Conversation 2-23-75

Srila Prabhupada explains how will questions be answered?
Every one of you must regularly read our books at least twice, in the morning and evening, and automatically all questions will be answered. (Srila Prabhupada Letter to Randhira, 24/01/70)

What will be the result of the wrong platform?

“So, on the wrong platform you may go-go forward more and more-but it will be dismantled, because it is wrong.” Lecture 6-5-74

DISCIPLE: One day they say one thing. One day they say something else.
PRABHUPADA: That means rascal. Room Conversation 2-23-75

“If you cannot express, if you do not understand. Simply people wants jugglery of words, they don’t want substance. They don’t want substance. That is the difficulty in the mod…, in the present age.” Lectures: Philosophy Discussions: Discussions with Hayagriva dasa: Karl Marx

It is interesting to note that Rupanuga dasa did not challenge the following article when Sridhar Maharaja was exposed.

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/12-07/editorials2250.htm

This article covers proof of the Ritvik initiation system of formality and the six accompanying articles in depth:

http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/02-09/editorials4085.htm

Jaya Srila Prabhupada
Yasoda nandana dasa 

————–

RUPANUGA VADA KHANDANA – PART 2 A –
REFUTATION OF RUPANUGA DASA’S INTEPRETATION OF THE OCTOBER 18, 1977 CONVERSATION
BY MAHESVARA DASA (MAHESH RAJA).

(Rupanuga das quotes this Los Angeles arrival lecture, May 18, 1972 to JUSTIFY they are INITIATING gurus)

Mahesh Raja says:
13. February 2016 at 3:36 pm

Rupanuga das: Srila Prabhupada said the following during his arrival address at the Los Angeles Temple on May 5, 1972:
“So, we have got this message from Krsna, from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, from the Six Goswamis; later on Bhaktivinode Thakur, Bhaktisiddhanta Thakur. And we are trying our bit to distribute this knowledge. Now tenth, eleventh, twelfth; my Guru Maharaj is the tenth from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, I am eleventh, you are twelfth.”

In the article, this last sentence was paraphrased from memory, but the meaning is still the same as Srila Prabhupada’s statement, which now becomes enhanced when taken in the context of his speech. He is obviously referring to his present disciples as the next in the disciplic succession he has just named and numbered, all of whom are directly initiating their own disciples.

Mahesh: this is just very CLEVER MANIPULATION from Rupanuga das to USE Srila Prabhupada’s words to make themselves as self-made gurus (Acaryas). This is BETRAYAL of Srila Prabhupada. They want to REPLACE Srila Prabhupada with THEMSELVES as Acaryas so that they go on with money screwing slavery making bogus conditioned soul (initiating “gurus”) business.

Let’s go back to 1977. These guys are just soooo ENVIOUS of Srila Prabhupada that they wanted to REPLACE Srila Prabhupada with THEMSELVES. HERE in this conversation you find Tamal Krsna was giving the hint of their POWER CRAZY Acarya usurp business. BUT Srila Prabhupada USED this to DENY them the ACARYA position by saying “I shall CHOOSE some guru. I SHALL SAY, “NOW YOU BECOME ACARYA. YOU BECOME AUTHORIZED. “Also note that May 5, 1972 LA Srila Prabhupada says “you are twelfth.” Rupanuga das is USING this to get his licence of Authorization BUT in 1977 he Srila Prabhupada is SPECIFIC: “I shall CHOOSE some guru. I SHALL SAY, “NOW YOU BECOME ACARYA. YOU BECOME AUTHORIZED:

Srila Prabhupada: What is the use of producing some rascal guru?
Tamala Krsna: Well, I have studied myself and all of your disciples, and it’s clear fact that WE ARE ALL CONDITIONED SOULS, SO WE CANNOT BE GURU. Maybe one day it may be possible…
Srila Prabhupada: Hm.
Tamala Krsna: …but not now.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes. I shall CHOOSE some guru. I SHALL SAY, “NOW YOU BECOME ACARYA. YOU BECOME AUTHORIZED.” I am waiting for that. You become all acarya. I retire completely. But the training must be complete. 770422r3.bom Conversations

Note:  Srila Prabhupada KNEW they were NOT Mahabhagavata so they can NOT be Acarya. SIMPLE AS THAT! Srila Prabhupada says “I SHALL SAY”.”I shall CHOOSE some guru.” But what happened is Srila Prabhupada did NOT SAY they are ACARYA. They went to Srila Prabhupada in 1977 TO BE NOMINATED as Acarya. HOWEVER Srila Prabhupada ONLY gave them the Ritvik System with SPECIFIC Order of July 9th 1977:

Satsvarupa: By the votes of the present GBC. THEN OUR NEXT QUESTION CONCERNS INITIATIONS IN THE FUTURE, PARTICULARLY AT THAT TIME WHEN YOU’RE NO LONGER WITH US. WE WANT TO KNOW HOW FIRST AND SECOND INITIATION WOULD BE CONDUCTED.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes. I shall recommend some of you. After this is settled up, I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating acaryas.
Tamala Krsna: Is that called rtvik-acarya?
Srila Prabhupada: RTVIK, YES. 770528me.vrn Conversations

MAHĀ-BHĀGAVATA-śreṣṭho / brāhmaṇo vai gurur nṛṇām
sarveṣām eva lokānām / asau pūjyo yathā hariḥ
ahā-kula-prasūto ‘pi / sarva-yajñeṣu DĪKṢITAḤ
sahasra-śākhādhyāyī ca / na guruḥ syād avaiṣṇavaḥ

((The guru MUST be situated on the topmost platform of devotional service. There are three classes of devotees, and the guru MUST be accepted from the topmost class. The first-class devotee is the spiritual master for all kinds of people. …When one has attained the topmost position of MAHA-BHAGAVATA, he is to be accepted as a guru and worshiped exactly like Hari, the Personality of Godhead. Only such a person is eligible to occupy the post of a guru.)) Madhya 24.330 The Sixty-One Explanations of the Atmarama Verse

Note:The word DIKSITAH refers to Diksa and ONLY Maha Bhagavata is the one mentioned WHO give this BY DEFINITION.    ****IF Srila Prabhupada would have ordered BEFORE 1977, then there would be no point in 1977 of him stating in 1977 WHEN I order. It was SPECIFICALLY in the year 1977 that Srila Prabhupada said “WHEN I order” NOT before, so AFTER the year 1977, WHERE is the evidence of THAT order?******

Srila Prabhupada:”WHEN I order, “You become guru,” he becomes regular guru. That’s all. He becomes disciple of my disciple. That’s it.”   Srila Prabhupada Conversation, May 28, 1977, Vrindavan)

“Self-made guru cannot be guru. HE MUST BE AUTHORIZED BY THE BONA FIDE GURU. Then he’s guru. This is the fact. Similarly, bona fide guru means he must be authorized by the superior guru.” (Srila Prabhupada Lecture on Nectar of Devotion, October 31. 1972)

“One should take initiation from a bona fide spiritual master coming in the disciplic succession, who is AUTHORIZED BY HIS PREDECESSOR SPIRITUAL MASTER. This is called diksa-vidhana.” (Srimad Bhagavatam 4.8.54, purport)

Srila Prabhupada: “Try to understand. Don’t go very speedily. A GURU CAN BECOME GURU WHEN HE’S ORDERED BY HIS GURU. That’s all. Otherwise nobody can become guru.   (Srila Prabhupada Lecture on Bhagavad-gita 7.2, Nairobi, October 28, 1975)
Facts:

1) the Order was NOT given. This is WHY Srila Prabhupada says WHEN I order:

Mahesh Raja: Only Maha-Bhagavata is Diksa Guru
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=41422#more-41422
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
WHEN I order
http://harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/03-08/editorials2603.htm
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Become Guru by Order, That’s All
http://harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/04-10/editorials5990.htm
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
What We Have Heard from the Spiritual Master, That is Living
http://harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/08-10/editorials6409.htm
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Srila Prabhupada’s Disciple
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/12-07/editorials2265.htm

2) to be a Mahabhagavata is NOT so cheap.

3) ONLY the PROMINENT Acarya is a ACCEPTED: Srila Prabhupada is PROMINENT ACARYA he IS Diksa Guru.
a) Srila Prabhupada’s books are QUOTED by ALL and WILL be QUOTED by ALL in future — so he is PROMINENT
b) Srila Prabhupada is worshiped as Jagad Guru in ALL his temples and ALL over the world — this will continue — so he is PROMINENT.

Srila Prabhupada: Regarding parampara system: THERE IS NOTHING TO WONDER FOR BIG GAPS. Just like we belong to the Brahma Sampradaya, so we accept it from Krishna to Brahma, Brahma to Narada, Narada to Vyasadeva, Vyasadeva to Madhva, and between Vyasadeva and Madhva there is a big gap. But it is sometimes said that Vyasadeva is still living, and Madhva was fortunate enough to meet him directly. In a similar way, we find in the Bhagavad-gita that the Gita was taught to the sungod, some millions of years ago, but Krishna has mentioned only three names in this parampara system–namely, Vivasvan, Manu, and Iksvaku; and so these gaps do not hamper from understanding the parampara system. WE HAVE TO PICK UP THE PROMINENT ACARYA, AND FOLLOW FROM HIM. There are many branches also from the parampara system, and it is not possible to record all the branches and sub-branches in the disciplic succession. We have to pick up from the authority of the acharya in whatever sampradaya we belong to. 68-04-12. Letter: Dayananda

Srila Prabhupada:  The GBC should all be the instructor gurus. I AM IN THE INITIATOR GURU, and you should be the instructor guru by teaching what I am teaching and doing what I am doing. This is not a title, but you must actually come to this platform. This I want. 75-08-04. Letter: Madhudvisa:

“I AM THE SPIRITUAL MASTER OF THIS INSTITUTION, AND ALL THE MEMBERS OF THE SOCIETY, THEY’RE SUPPOSED TO BE MY DISCIPLES. They follow the rules and regulations which I ask them to follow, AND THEY ARE INITIATED BY ME SPIRITUALLY.”(Srila Prabhupada Radio Interview, 12/3/1968)
“Guru-mukha-padma-vakya, cittete koriya aikya, ara na koriho mane asa. Don’t think of any nonsense. Simply execute what your guru has said. That is success.”   (28th January, 1977, Room Conversation)

IT IS NOT POSSIBLE TO GO BACK TO GODHEAD IN ONE LIFE, BUT IN THE HUMAN FORM ONE SHOULD AT LEAST UNDERSTAND THE GOAL OF LIFE AND BEGIN KRSNA CONSCIOUSNESS.
SB 3.15.24 P Description of the Kingdom of God

Note: It is NOT possible to go back to Godhead in ONE LIFE this is WHY we chant Janme Janme Prabhu sei — this means Srila Prabhupada is there with us in OTHER LIVES AFTER to finish OUR Jail term in this material world. HOW can one be LIBERATED Maha Bhagavata to deliver OTHERS if he HIMSELF is NOT delivered IN ONE LIFE:

760805BG.PAR Lectures
Devotee: If we don’t finish our Krsna consciousness in this life, how we come in contact with the guru in next life?
Srila Prabhupada: Yes, that arrangement will be done, you go on with your business. We are singing this song daily. Why do you forget? Cakhu-dan dilo jei JANME JANME PRABHU SEI. ONE WHO HAS OPENED THE EYES, HE’LL REMAIN MY MASTER LIFE AFTER LIFE.

740302mw.may Conversations
Bhavananda: spiritual master. Then when he reaches a certain point, he lets go. What is? What becomes of Him? He is also Mayavadi.
Prabhupada: Yes. That is Mayavadi philosophy. (break) philosophy, cakhudana dilo yei janme JANME PRABHU SEI. NAROTTAMA DASA THAKURA SINGS THAT, “ONE WHO HAS OPENED MY EYES, MY SPIRITUAL MASTER, HE’S MY FATHER, LIFE AFTER LIFE.” SO HOW HE CAN, HE CAN SAY, “GO AWAY NOW”? THAT IS MAYAVADA PHILOSOPHY.

NoD 8 Offenses to Be Avoided
The offenses against the chanting of the holy name are as follows: (3) To disobey the orders of the spiritual master.

“A devotee should have intelligence to know who is deviating. SURRENDER BY YOUR INTELLIGENCE BUT DON’T SURRENDER YOUR INTELLIGENCE.” (SP to Bali Mardana, 1974)

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Srila Prabhupada IS Diksa Guru
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=43094#more-43094
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Only Maha-Bhagavata is Diksa Guru
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=41422#more-41422
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Srila Prabhupada THE ONLY CURRENT ETERNAL DIKSA GURU for ISKCON for AS LONG AS ISKCON EXISTS – NO COMPROMISE!
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=44113#more-44113
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Physically Present Diksa Guru
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=42978#comment-31641
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=42978#comment-31834
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Note: Their REAL business of these CON men is to REPLACE Srila Prabhupada as Diksa guru so that they can SCREW money and USE others as their SLAVES:

Bhaktivedanta Manor Accounts SALARIES
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=38907#comment-24810
http://apps.charitycommission.gov.uk/Accounts/Ends49/0000259649_ac_20111231_e_c.pdf
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/01-08/editorials2459.htm
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Note: what these CON artists want is make it a OPEN order from Srila Prabhupada that they have got license to be Acarya by using:

yāre dekha, tāre kaha ‘kṛṣṇa’-upadeśa
āmāra ājñāya guru hañā tāra’ ei deśa

BUT even that is REFUTED:
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=40622#more-40622

Reply
Mahesh Raja says:
13. February 2016 at 6:12 pm

Rupanuga das:….has just named and numbered, all of whom are directly initiating their own disciples.

Note:  Mahesh: Bogus! “named and numbered” So—- WHERE is [are] the names IN THE LETTER? There is [are] NO names in that 1972 letter. This is just MANIPULATIVE CUNNING WORD JUGGLERY to fool the public from Rupanuga das.

Note: Rupanuga das says…… “all of whom are directly initiating their own disciples.”

These are ALL a gang of ROGUES. The disciples are FACTUALLY Srila Prabhupada’s BUT they STOLE them:

Srila Prabhupada’s Disciple
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=43453#more-43453
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/12-07/editorials2265.htm
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Brief History of Guru Hoax in ISKCON
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/12-07/editorials2302.htm

Reply
Mahesh Raja says:
13. February 2016 at 6:57 pm

Rupanuga das quotes this Los Angeles arrival lecture, May 18, 1972 to JUSTIFY they are INITIATING gurus:
“So we have got this message from Krsna, from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, from the six Gosvamis, later on Bhaktivinoda Thakura, Bhaktisiddhanta Thakura. And we are trying our bit also to distribute this knowledge. Now, tenth, eleventh, twelfth. . . My Guru Maharaja is tenth from Caitanya Mahaprabhu, I am eleventh, you are the twelfth. So distribute this knowledge.  ( Los Angeles arrival lecture, May 18, 1972 )

Note: this Lecture only states about DISTRIBUTE the KNOWLEDGE: “And we are trying our bit also to distribute this knowledge.” “So distribute this knowledge”.

It is about DISTRIBUTE KNOWLEDGE it is NOT saying they are DIKSA guru.
This has also been answered by the IRM folks long time back:
Indradyumna Maharaja has no answers

—————

RUPANUGA VADA KHANDANA – PART 3 –
A REFUTATION OF RUPANUGA DASA’S INTEPRETATION OF THE OCTOBER 18, 1977 CONVERSATION
BY DAMAGHOSA DASA

COMMENTS ABOUT RUPANUGA’S WEBSITE
By Damaghosa das… my reply is in italic, for clarity sake…

Dear Rupanuga Prabhu, Obeisances, All glories to Srila Prabhupada

Thank you for putting up this website about Prabhapada’s position and his books.
http://www.rupanugadas.com/ – I had a few comments below I wanted to make…if I may

you write…
“In the article, this last sentence was paraphrased from memory, but the meaning is still the same as Srila Prabhupada’s statement, which now becomes enhanced when taken in the context of his speech. He is obviously referring to his present disciples as the next in the disciplic succession he has just named and numbered, all of whom are directly initiating their own disciples.

This is a very contentious point, as you well know. Many of our Godbrothers ARE initiating disciples, but where is the actual order for them to do that?
To my knowledge, there is no order. The only order he gave just prior to leaving his body was for the GBC (and others in the future) to become officiating acaryas. To initiate on his behalf. That’s all.This order was never amended or stopped. This lecture given in 1972 could also mean he wanted us, his disciples to continue as siksa gurus and not diksa gurus, especially after seeing what happened in his Gaudiya matha. And you were the recipient of that famous letter in 1974..

74-04-28.Rup Letter: Rupanuga
His idea was acarya was not to be nominated amongst the governing body.He said
openly you make a GBC and conduct the mission. So his idea was amongst the members of GBC who would come out successful and self effulgent acarya would be automatically selected. So Sridhara Maharaja and his two associate gentlemen unauthorizedly selected one acarya and later it proved a failure. The result is now everyone is claiming to be acarya even though they may be kanistha adhikari with no ability to preach. In some of the camps the acarya is being changed three times a year. Therefore we may not commit the same mistake in our ISKCON camp. Actually amongst my Godbrothers no one is qualified to become acarya. So it is better not to mix with my Godbrothers very intimately because instead of inspiring our students and disciples they may sometimes pollute them. This attempt was made previously by them, especially Madhava Maharaja and Tirtha Maharaja and Bon Maharaja but somehow or other I saved the situation. This is going on. We shall be very careful about them and not mix with them. This is my instruction to you all. They cannot help us in our movement, but they are very competent to harm our natural progress. So we must be very careful about them.

Srila Prabhupada also told us he was the initiating spiritual master and all of us were the instructing spiritual masters. There is a huge difference between the two. Both are supposed to say the same thing, but one has the spiritual power to take on sins whereas the other (siksa guru) only needs to give instruction to pass on the param para knowledge.And then there is the massive qualifications needed to take on that function of giving diksa. Two things, be ordered, and be qualified. So neither element is there in iskcon gurus. They were not ordered, specifically, nor are they qualified. Just being a good “boy” for some years by following the 4 reg’s and chanting Hare Krsna is not the only qualification, nor is opening temples and preaching at various places.

Just for starters, here are some of the qualifications Srila Prabhupada mentions one MUST have if he is to initiate others.’

1.) 761003SB.VRN Lectures 214022/530501
guru… Sisyas te ‘ham sadhi mam prapannam: “Now, Krsna, I  accept You as my guru. Not as friend.” Because friendly talking is useless  waste of time. He accepted Him as guru. When guru speaks, you cannot  argue. That is not the process. You should accept a guru who is  infallible. Otherwise it is useless. He accepted guru Krsna because Krsna  is infallible. If we accept guru, a bogus guru, then it is no  benefit. Guru means Krsna’s representative. Not that  everyone can be guru.  

2.) 61101SB.VRN  Lectures  225162/530501
This is religion. Adau gurvasrayam. If you do not get a  qualified guru, then everything is bogus. If you, by good fortune, if you  get the association of a guru, qualified hamsa, paramahamsa…  Paramahamsa guru means sannyasi’s last stage is paramahamsa. Kuticaka,  bahudaka, parivrajakacarya, and paramahamsa, these are the different  stages. When one takes sannyasa, he lives outside the village in a kuti, in  a cottage, and the family members goes and delivers him the food, because  he is not practiced. So in the beginning, he keeps up this association of  neighborhood or family, but he is not practiced. He therefore lives outside  the village, and if somebody gives some food, he eats. Then when he becomes  experienced, then he does not accept food from one, either his own home or  one home. He takes foodstuff from many homes: “Give me a little piece of  capati.” So somebody gives half, because they are also not overburdened. If  they have to deliver, so many sannyasis come, and sumptuous food, then how  the grhastha will provide? Therefore though… They do not overburden. There  may be other sannyasis, therefore little only. Madhupuri. The  Gosvamis practiced this madhupuri in Vrndavana. They lived, but they would  take little only from the house. This is called bahudaka. Then when he  has practiced more, he travels all over the world, parivrajakacarya.  And when he is fully experienced, then, in spiritual life and  everything, then he is paramahamsa. So one must find out a guru  who is paramahamsa. Neither kuticaka, nor bahudaka, nor  parivrajakacarya. Paramahamsa. …. Then our strong desire to  enjoy this material world in different way, that will be slackened. That is  wanted.    Thank you very much.

3.) Madhya 24.330   When one has attained the topmost position of maha-bhagavata, he is to be accepted as a guru and worshiped exactly like Hari, the Personality of Godhead. Only such a person is eligible to occupy the post of a guru.

4.) SSR 2 Choosing a Spiritual Master  182103/530501
Reporter: I wondered how many people you think might have been  taken in by fake gurus. Srila Prabhupada: Practically  everyone. [Laughter.] There is no question of counting.  Everyone. Reporter: This would mean thousands of people,  wouldn’t it? Srila Prabhupada: Millions. Millions have been cheated,  because they want to be cheated. God is omniscient. He can  understand your desires. He is within your heart, and if you want to be  cheated, God sends you a cheater.

—-

you write…
He is speaking about distributing the knowledge of the parampara by his disciples, whether they distribute the (same) knowledge as vartma-pradarsaka, siksa or diksa gurus, depending on the capacity and qualifications of the individual disciple. The point is to expand on the principle that guru is one, not two. As Srila Prabhupada remarked elsewhere, if two gurus disagree, either one is not a bona fide guru or both are not bona fide. He means that because guru is one, all real gurus teach the same thing, Krsna consciousness.

So if guru is one and these gurus supposedly all teach all the same thing, why do we have so many different siddhantas within the iskcon camp? For starters, why have they totally changed the process of offering bhoga? Prabhupada told us, and you are well aware of this, that everything is first offered to guru, then up the param para until one reaches Krsna. Iskcon now does it totally opposite. So how is this param para gurus?
When somebody teaches opposite the Acarya, Srila Prabhupada, he calls them demons, not even devotees!. Here is the proof.

►740704BG.HON Lectures
Prabhupada: Then so siksa and diksa-guru… A siksa-guru who instructs against the instruction of spiritual, he is not a siksa guru. He is a demon. Siksa-guru, diksa-guru means… Sometimes a diksa-guru is not present always. Therefore, one can take learning, instruction, from an advanced devotee. That is called the siksa-guru. Siksa-guru does not mean he is speaking something against the teachings of the diksa-guru. He is not a siksa-guru. He is a rascal.

73-01-04.Din, Letter: Dhruvananda
The greatest danger to our movementwill come when we manufacture and create our own process for worshiping the deities. So don’t ask any more new questions, whatever is going on, follow it just to the exact standard as I have given you, that’s all.

So not only are these so called leaders in iskcon changing the very fundamentals of how to worship the Lord, Srila Prabhupada calls them demons and are the GREATEST DANGER to this movement !! And you think they are spiritual masters??
How do you explain this massive discrepancy prabhu? I would be very grateful if you could supply me your answer prabhu.

you write…
That is what it means to be a guru as defined by Lord Krsna Himself. In the Gita, He tells Arjuna one must surrender to a guru humbly and render service to him, with inquiries; then that guru “will impart knowledge unto you…” That knowledge is defined in the next verse: “And when you have thus learned the truth, you will know that all living beings are but part of Me – and that they are in Me, and are Mine.” (4.35) In other words, Lord Krsna clearly defines the bona fide guru in terms of what he or she teaches: Krsna consciousness. God is one, guru is one, although teaching according to time and circumstances.

So Srila Prabhupada is notifying his disciples that they are the next authorized gurus to distribute the knowledge, as he has done. Of course, he expected they would practice what they preached, that is the qualification and character. Only now, instead of one big guru, Srila Prabhupada, he envisioned many smaller gurus to continue distributing the (same) knowledge all over the world. Once before, he called it “old wine in a new bottle.” How else will Lord Caitanya’s Name be known in every town and village? Srila Prabhupada’s followers have the assignment.

Again, where is the actual order in Prabhupada’s final days, other than the one where he authorizes officiating acaryas?? There is no such order prabhu !!

All these quotes you supply can also be taken to mean that all the disciples of Srila Prabhupada should become gurus, spiritual masters, but as SIKSA GURUS, that’s all. It is only personal ambition that makes one think, yes I AM qualified to become an initiating spiritual master. No bona fide guru ever wants to be an acarya.

Prabhupada told us several time when  Srila Bhaktisiddhanta maharaj appeared to him at least twice in dreams to take up sannyasa, he was “horrified”. Why was he horrified? Because he knew what was involved and really did not want to do it. Jesus Christ said the same thing, “let this cup pass from me if possible, Lord.” But because these great souls are totally surrendered to the Lord, they do what He asks of them. Unlike others who WANT this position because of name and fame.
In the C.C. it is mentioned NOT to accept disciples. Why? Because of the difficulty of taking on the karma.
If it was so easy to take on the disciples karma, then why do we have the ugly and embarrassing stories of so many failures of so called stalwart leaders in iskcon?

Madhya 7.130   One should not try to be an artificially advanced devotee, thinking, “I am a first-class devotee.” Such thinking should be avoided. It is best not to accept any disciples. One has to become purified at home by chanting the Hare Krsna maha-mantra and preaching the principles enunciated by Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. Thus one can become a spiritual master and be freed from the contamination of material life.

So in the above quote, he tells us to remain at home, dont take disciples but become a spiritual master.

This seems contradictory doesn’t it? So how can one become a spiritual master- without diciples? – Be siksa guru. Bas…

You write…
Arjuna was told by Lord Krsna that the battle was already won, but Krsna wanted him to help make it happen and get credit for success. Similarly, Lord Caitanya said His Name would be known in every town and village. What God predicts comes true. Srila Prabhupada has given the chance – a matchless opportunity – for his followers to help the Lord execute His will. In whatever capacity, one can join with Srila Prabhupada in saying, “And we are trying our bit to distribute this knowledge.” That is, trying to pass it on as it is. All glories to Srila Prabhupada…

In conclusion I will say this, that the final instructions of the guru are the most important ones. All the others he gives along the way may be applicable to individuals or the group, according to time place and circumstances. But the most important of all of them is what he says in his final days. These final instructions supersede all other instructions. And they are the final ones.  Here is the proof…

1.)    SRILA PRABHUPADA: “I may say many things to you, but when I say something directly, “Do it”, your first duty is to do that. You cannot argue, “Sir, you said me like this before.” No, that is not your duty. What I say now, you do it. That is obedience. If the captain of the ship says “Five degrees starboard” and the first mate replies, “But captain, before you told me ‘Ten degrees port’,” then it can be understood that the first mate has gone insane.” — lecture by Srila Prabhupada on the Srimad-Bhagavatam, Hyderabad, India, April 15, 1975   710217rc.gor Conversations 325478/530501

2.) 750327rc.may Conversations 376438/530501
Atreya Rsi: …I am degraded. “Very seriously, or may be given to me from time to time directly, these directions, by my aforesaid Guru Maharaja, or through his books, or…” In other words, direction given, instruction given, directly by him or through his…
Prabhupada: Better directly.
Atreya Rsi: No “His books”?
Prabhupada: No.
Atreya Rsi: Not necessary.
Prabhupada: Because I may give direction according to the time.
Atreya Rsi: “Or” means both.
Prabhupada: Hm?
Atreya Rsi: “Or” can mean… All right. “Or through his commissioners…”(?)
Prabhupada: Direct, direct instruction is important. Just like Krsna. In the books He has given many instructions, but then He says, sarva-dharman parityaja. If one says that “You gave me instruction before like this. How can I give up this?” so that is not important. The direct instruction is important.

3.) Devotee: …then why is any one activity of Krsna consciousness better than another one? Why is any one way of serving Krsna better than another? For example, with chanting of the sixteen rounds. Suppose that you’ve gone 23 hours of the day serving Krsna in one way or another, and the last hour there is opportunity to finish your rounds and also opportunity to make a life member. So instead of chanting your sixteen rounds…
Prabhupada: But you cannot create your concoction! You have to abide by the orders of Krsna.
Devotee: Then why…
Prabhupada: There is no question of why. It is the order of Krsna’s representative. You have to abide by that.You cannot say, “Why?” Then you are not fully surrendered, as soon as you say, “Why?” Surrender means there is no [surrender]”Why?” It is ordered; it has to be done. That’s all. As soon as there is “Why?”, there is no surrender. The basic principle is misguided. We have to follow. Just like we have got tilaka. If you say, “Why this tilaka?” There is no question of “Why?”Mahajano yena gatah sa pantha. We have been instructed by the acaryas; we have to follow that. That is surrender. You cannot say, “Why?” Is that clear? As soon as there is “Why?”, there is no surrender.

Thank you again for posting your new website. I asked you once a couple years back when do you think the book changes will stop? Your reply (in snail mail) to me was when critical mass amongst the devotees was reached. I agree, and similarly with the issue of guru tattva.

All the problems we see in Iskcon today are all due to guru aparadhastarting with the sin of wanting to BE guru. Once guru tattva is properly understood, and we all understand our respective positions, and places not to go, then Srila Prabhupada will be properly worshipped, and the full blessings of him, the param para, the Goswamis, and the Panca Tattva will be realized.

Parma vijate Sri Krsna Sankirtan
Damaghosa das