Yamuna Protest-Song “Der heilige Strom” from GourTube on Vimeo.
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Nice song, nice video, nice idea
thats the way to make people aware
of the problem in the holy dham.
Dont be grumpy, it is kaliyuga folks,
and we cant built fences around life,
since busy making progress………
and even if the goverment build the highway to nowhere
we are on our stairway to heaven,
thats what the song is all about, nice indeed.
Yes, this song will stay alive in the minds of many,
and by the way, brindaban is first of all in the heart of the devotees.
So let the good times roll on, while remembering brindaban as it is,
as it just to be when Srila Prabhupada walked the ground….!
The song nice in deed, the cause undisputable! Yet I would like to ask Paramshreya who sings the song whether his proposal of unity in the song is really serious and honest. The singer is one of the strongest supporters of false “ISKCON” guru system, he doesn’t care about books changes, he even writes full of lies history of “ISKCON”, so call “Die Erben von Hare Krishnas”, and much more nosense. On their “enlightening” page http://www.gour-ni-times.de/ we can see smiling, relaxed face of Prithu das giving chees tips! So, the question is, whether it is the right source of inspiration? Personally I am quite sure, that if ISKCON and we all were obidient to Srila Prabhupada, the Sampradaya Acarya and His orders, than nobody would dare so rudely build such nonsense bridge in the abode of the Lord of the Universe.
Right Jagaddarta prabhu, according Indian law environmental activism is illegal unless you have Indian citizenship. What happened in Vrindavan, they all knew before the project started, during the planning period, that the government is going to turn Vrindavan into a traffic hell.
At that point, before the construction companies started, the Vaishnava Institutions should have informed the residents of Vrindavan to make a veto. To get the mayor of Vrindavan to prevent those building projects. To get UNESCO declare Vrindavan as cultural heritage. Seemingly this never happened.
Instead the Vaishnava institutions started to collect funds from foreigners to “SAVE VRINDAVAN”. Result was nothing happened, the construction companies started their job according time schedule.
Same now, songs are written rather as humorous interlude, but the construction workers will be jubilantly going on to do their job.
I think it is not proper to call me “one of the strongest supporters of false “ISKCON†guru system”. I spoke out so much critizism against the current Guru System. Could you please tell us exactly where in our book I am the “one of the strongest supporter”? (page, line etc.) Sorry, but this is all primitive bashing. Let people decide for themselves by reading our book.
Thank you, Accheddya Prabhu, for posting our song. After this whole “Erben-Thing” we need now a little break of fun
Dear Paramshreya prabhu, while accusing you of supporting the nonsense “ISKCON” so call”guru system” I was speaking of an aggregate, complex position you take in your devotional practices. I am not going to advertise your institutional efforts and books here. The point is who are you worshiping, to who are you offering the results of your activities. I say you are strong supporter of fake “gurus” and the once Prabhupada ISKCON hijackers, who have stollen it from Him and His disciples. Are you not? Then please say it prabhu. Or proof I am wrong. Simple things. Show us any paper signed by Srila Prabhupada where He does order 11 disciples to become gurus! Show then any paper signed by Srila Prabhupada to even multiple the number of unqualified disciples to become gurus, to which are you surrendering now. Any dokument here, any quote, tape? No, the point is there is no such dokument, there is no such teaching point of His Divine Grace, so the whole institution you glorify by you deeds is bhogus. This is the problem with the strong supporters of “ISKCON”, they are blind. I know you prabhu, since you was bhakta Philip, I think since that time you didn’t realized much about so call “gurus”, who are you surrendering to, all the time. When I wrote you about books changes, what was your answer? Not everything is black and white, …bla, bla, bla . You are supporter of false, fake gurus, and this is the problem nowadays. Without people like you they would remain with no resources, since they are spiritually naked cheaters. Is time for change, they have to go away, stop offences to the Acarya and Founder of ISKCON, then the humble prayer may clarify everything by His mercy, no debate establishes spiritual reality.
ps. you write in your book about soft and hart Ritvik liners, but this is no the point of the debate! The point is that Srila Prabhupada never authorised 11 disciples to become full fledged gurus, and no 1986 so call reform changed anything about this scam from march 1978, the point here is the DOM recejction by the fake GBC’s, the point is savaged REDITING of the BOOKS, the point is FAKE, FAKE Scam, and you are wanting to change it?! How? By making politics!The only way begins with rejection of the rascals, then prayer, and humble surrender to the Acarya, no politics, “cake” sharing debates, no speculations, no positions, and institutional nonsenses anymore Paramshreya prabhu. It is a war, a long war between demons and devas, so there is no joke! Spiritually everything is Krishna, this is a fact, but not for us, not yet, for us the things are of black and white color, maya and Krishna , surrender or offender, we have the choice! It is a very serious matter here!
y.s jagaddarta das
Dear Paramshreya das prabhu, and dear Prabhupadanugas PAMHO! AGTSP!
I want to appologize for my chaotic and much offensive response to your recent comment Pramshreya Prabhu.
I want to make it clear now what is my conviction after searching for more then three years now about the guru issue. It was a very nervous and tense period for me. The current situation in regard to devotional siddhantas and choices which follow them is not at all easy, neither for me, nor for anyone else. We see strong and deep factional divisions, where there is no much space for a normal, gradual development of genuine bhakti. Every step in such tense and uncertain situations is very dangerous, since we all don’t want to commit offences, especially to the pure devotees. I tried to keep independent and unbiased thinking , but the streams and waves in the wild ocean of different school of thoughts, especially about diksa, didn’t make it easy at all! Now the time came, I feel I have to end my confussion, and take back to practice the science of bhakti, as per SB 1.2.18, this is the only way to understand the Truth, not by factional, sectarian thinking of any kind. My understanding is that we can’t realize anything about guru issue through speculative means. The method of becoming guru is delineated by Srila Prabhupada in a simple way, Srila Prabhupada: Try to understand. Don’t go very speedily. A guru can become guru when he is ordered by his guru. That’s all. Otherwise nobody can become guru. (SP Bg. Lecture, 28/10/75) So, I want to say I am not a ritvik proponent, as I stated many times here, I was allready cheated by the same person you Paramshreya prabhu was cheated too, by HKS, a fake mahabhagavata zonal acarya. Now, what you propose in your book is a new mixture, whre you start to make even more good wish thinkin like speculations, but this is nothing more but supporting the status quo, since current “ISKCON GURU SYSTEM” is just this kind of speculation, a never ending story! Paramshreya prabhu, just look what our Acarya says in the above quote! Why to debate on it?! This is my point! We are here to support the will of the acarya, doesn’t matter how many people will dislike us! The truth is what is been repeated since time immemorial by GURUSADHU. I do ask all Prabhupadanugas Prabhus, and all ISKCON members to forgive me my unlimited offences, but the truth is nobody of your groups is right about diksa, as to what model of diksa should be followed. There is no other method except the one our sampradaya functions since it’s beginning. Prabhupada wanted His disciples to become Gurus, perfect followers, dedicated and qualified disciples. This is the law of disciplic succession, but
“yare dekha, tare kaha, krsna-upadesa. You haven’t got to manufacture anything. What Krsna has already said, you repeat. Finish. Don’t make addition, adulteration. Then you become guru […] I may be fool, rascal […] So we have to follow this path, that you become guru, deliver your neighbourhood men, associates, but speak the authoritative words of Krsna. Then it will act […] Anyone can do. A child can do.” (SP Evening darsan, 11/5/77, Hrsikesh)
“Because people are in darkness, we require many millions of gurus to enlighten them. Therefore Caitanya Mahaprabhu’s mission is, […] He said that “Everyone of you become guru.” (SP Lecture, 21/5/76, Honolulu)
“You simply say […] “Just always think of Me”, Krsna said, “And just become My devotee. Just worship Me and offer obeisances.” Kindly do these things.” So if you can induce one person to do these things, you become guru. Is there any difficulty?” (SP Conversation, 2/8/76, Paris)
“Real guru is he who instructs what Krsna has said….You have simply to say, ‘This is this.’ That’s all. Is it very difficult task?” (SP Lecture, 21/5/76, Honolulu)
“…’But I have no qualification. How can I become guru ?’ There is no need of qualification…Whomever you meet, you simply instruct what Krsna has said. That’s all. You become guru.” (SP Lecture, 21/5/76, Honolulu)
But to initiate disciples one need to become a perfect follower , and he must be ordered by his Guru, by Prabhupada, this can’t be rubber stamped, this can’t be a matter of compromises between some camps, or parties, either soft nor ultra soft even! No matter what! Prabhupada has followed a perfect system, where the perfect follower is automatically blessed by the Acarya, and such person takes over the duty of initiating people to become devotees, it maybe unlimited number of such persons, this is the desire of any genuine Guru. But the restriction is to become first a perfect follower! So then there will be a visible proof of genuineness, no books changing, no guru voting, no bhogus higher rasa teachings, no child molesting, no hindu hodge podge, no Bollywood songs, no reiki seminars, car pujas, devas worship, anything of that kind, but also not giving us the impression of becoming direct diksha disciples of Prabhupada. It can’t be the truth Prabhus! It is no stated anywhere by Prabhupada! Nowhere! It is mental concoction done by us only!
I am certain that we may become spiritually successful only after we will follow the simple rule Prabhupada established:
“And to become acarya is not very difficult. […] amara ajnaya guru hana tara ei desa, yare dekha tare kaha krsna-upadesa: “By following My order, you become guru.” […] Then, in future… suppose you have got now ten thousand. We shall expand to hundred thousand. That is required. Then hundred thousand to million; and million to ten million.” (SP C.c. Lecture, 6/4/75, Mayapur)
So, let us not support mistaken ideas which go against the real order of the Acarya!
Dear Paramshreya prabhu, please forgive me my offensive and harsh language, and all accusations! Dear Prabhupadanugas Prabhus and Mothers please forgive me my offences and offten my lack of mental stabillity as shown in some of my comments I did here by your kindness. Jaya Srila Prabhupada! Jay Sri Sri Guru And Gauranga!
y.s jagaddarta das
Dear Jagaddarta Prabhu
Please accept our respectful obeisances!
All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
Thank you for your letter. I accept your apology. I now remember you. Twenty years ago we had quite an affectionate relationship and there is actually no need for harsh words or bad feelings even if there may be some differences in opinion. I have written that book together with Shivatma Dasa and many other helpers and all of us felt quite hurt and also misrepresented by your words like that we were “one of the strongest supporters of the false ISKCON guru system” etc. For your sincer apology we want to thank you all.
We also thank the administrators of this blog for publishing various opinions.
If we will have some time in the coming days, we will try to give a more elaborately reply to Jagaddarta Prabhu’s points.
Hare Krishna,
your servants
Paramshreya Dasa, Shivatma Dasa & Friends
GOUR-NI-TIMES Freundeskreis e.V.