Jaya, Gaura Keshava Prabhu; PAMHO. I have not done any independent research on this area, but am mostly going with what I have heard from other devotees. I DO know what is going on in Toronto and Montreal, however, having served there from the seventies, and having lived in both temples relatively recently. In Toronto, there are almost no Prabhupada disicples at all. There used to be thirty or forty living there, before Bhaktimarga took over. God brothers from there, who I met outside, tell me that Bhaktimarga Swami and team consistently drive Prabhupada disciples away (eventually myself included). This was done by actually lying, email propaganda campaign, and spying!
The Prabhupada devotee who lives there has cautioned me to keep my mouth shut, as the management is very anti-Prabhupada disciples actually living there, or God forbid they should ever disagree with the fat salaries and pandering!! The Hindus have publicly criticized Western devotees there as “having no love for their families, hence they easily joined Iskcon”. People are actually discouraged from thinking of joining the temple full time as residents, as the management don’t want to support them; too much trouble for them.
I personaly saw three young men who wanted to shave up told to go away. They were good young fellows too, not crazies. Toronto temple houses the glorious Radha Gopinatha. I was there for their installation, served them at the temple and passing out literature on Yonge street, etc. Now Bhaktimarga Swami says I am unloyal to Iskcon for writing one article saying that I am in favor of all Vaisnavas everywhere, and that we need to work together. That was actually my mild position! Now, I say run the demons out of our master’s temples!!
In Montreal, the situation is almost as bad; Prabhupada disciples are driven out and not even allowed to attend harinama sankirtana!!, unless they swallow the idea and espouse same, that Radhanatha is as good as God. And please don’t think I exaggerate, these things happened to me personally. Their emphasis is on cooking and Sunday programs, maybe 2% of the devotees ever go on sankirtana there.
So at least 95% of the devotees whose spiritual master built and owns the temples, are run out by usurpers and thieves, in the name of gurus. This is because the management teams are mostly corrupt and not Prabhupada disciples, or have become dependent for money on Hindus and those who have bought the guruvadi old-boy rubber stamp system. They have become like small-minded selfish businessmen and paid beaurocrats.
You are right to question much of what is popularly said on these websites. There is a big gulf between reality and popular opinions sometimes! In this case, there is little doubt of the fact that we have been ousted from our own temples by punks, and that at least in Canada, it is by far the majority.
By the way, I am not associated with any camp, ritvik or whatever you want to call. I am simple a follower of Srila Prabhupada’s Iskcon. Get out of my master’s temples!! Actually, most of these web sites indulge in sentiment only and false accusations and innuendo. One has to sort through the info and look for internal consistencies, the better to judge mere radicalism.
Mostly the guruvadis simply slander with no basis in any truth whatsoever, demonstrating that there is no brahmana among them, simply panderers, and bootlicking opportunists and blasphemers. If there is no fault, they invent one. The bigger the lie, the more the fools of this world believe them. A dialogue with them is impossible; I don’t bother anymore. Let them go to hell. They are not innocent, but actually black hearts, devotees dressed like Vaisnavas but full of ambition and hatred.
With these rascals in my face every day, I have learned also to hate some of them back. This is not good.
HKHR!
YS Tamoharadasa
Further to my description of difficulties encountered at the Toronto and Montreal temples recently, as published by you above on this very interesting website;
I have described negative aspects, crucial problems which demand address lest all be ruined. But in all fairness meanwhile, please allow me to also elaborate somewhat on the many positive aspects. I suppose this is like praising the qualtity of the milk, despite the serpent’s tongue touch which spoils it. Nonetheless; The harinama party in Toronto is fantastic, the Deities are gorgeously dressed, a solid morning program has gone on there for years, the Jagannatha Rathayata is unsurpassed, devotees carry on with many outside programs including prasad distribution at major fairs, the kirtanas and bhajana almost never stop, and there are thousands of congregational members. So, although there are major problems, it is not that devotional service has ceased for all of us, or that the general devotees there are not worthy of our respect and well wishes.
Same in Montreal; Sri Sri Radha-Manohara are dressed very beautifully. There are many nice devotees who keep out of any politics, (and this unfortunately means the the more political seem to rule for so-called practical reasons.) Nontheless, there are many wonderful Vaisnavas in these temples and congregations, and it would entirely false to suggest that there are not innocent and pure devotees still serving in both temples. The Montreal management is doing their best in difficult times.
My obeisances to them, and apologies for having to point out faults. As I have stated before, I am for all the Vaisnavas, and suggest that although the GBC leaders are misleading in too many ways, many of the devotees are for what is best for all sincere souls, and we should carefully avoid slandering the well-intentioned in our zeal to oust the usurpers and haters. PAMHO.
ISKCON did everywhere the same, to kick out each and every Prabhupada disciple unless he belongs to the guru club. All over Europe they even kicked out all those thousands of ex-disciples, all senior brahmins, whose gurus fell down. Since Srila Prabhupada nowhere teaches to kick out sincere brahmins from his movement, there is nothing wrong pointing out and exposing this roguery of present ISKCON managers. You say, “my obeisances to them”, this is surely correct, but notice, since ISKCON policy is to kick out all brahmins whenever a new guru is put in charge for this temple, who focuses to support only his own disciples, they might be the next brahmins to pack their bags. So, it is our duty to not keep silent and constantly let dirty work repeat itself.
Yes, you are so right. However, we do not wish to alienate the good people by appearing too condemning of all, carte blanche. After all, we are representing Prahupada’s mercy. Let us tell the truth, but encourage inclusivness and unity in our struggle, and try to bring in all who are capable of seeing the truth. Criticize the deviations,(ie. not necessarily calling the individuals deviants, which labels them as followers of Fiskcon and which designation they may then tend to cause them to adhere all the harder to and justify their deviations, out of a psychological defense mechanism) praise and encourage those following Prabhupada (even if but misguided neophytes), and thoroughly expose and then squash the usurpers! That may be extra effective psychologically and sociologically.
I see so much fighting, and not enough loving. May both go on in fullest!
Jaya, Gaurahari bolo, bhais!!
Hi Tamoharadasa,
I wonder if you are the same person who messaged me on Youtube recently…
If you are, please email me at scsbo@yahoo.com
Arthur Tsaturyan
Thanks