“So if you are able to follow these principles
without fail, then you are as good as my disciple.”
Letter to: Suresh Candra, London , 11 August, 1972
My dear Suresh Candra,
Please accept my blessings. I have received your letter from Guyana dated 16 July, 1972, duly forwarded to me at my London address. Thank you very much for the sentiments expressed therein. A disciple means one who is always following the orders of the spiritual master. So I instruct my disciples to refrain from four prohibitions, namely no eating of meat, fish or eggs, no illicit sex life, no taking of intoxication, including tea, coffee, cigarettes, etc., and no gambling. Besides that my students must chant sixteen rounds of japa-mala of Hare Krsna mantra daily. So if you are able to follow these principles without fail, then you are as good as my disciple. And after you have practiced these things for a few months’ time, then we can see to your formal initiation. This chanting of sixteen rounds of japa-mala daily, chanting the full Hare Krsna mantra, Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare/Hare Rama Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare, on each bead 108 times in each round, this process will very quickly purify your existence, and you will come to your rightful spiritual understanding in very short order. Since you have asked me, this is my advice to you. You and your family sit down and chant daily some japa and have some kirtana (or chanting Hare Krsna mantra in full, with kartals and mrdanga. (Letter to: Suresh Candra, London , 11 August, 1972 )
THE RITVIK REPRESENTATIVE OF THE ACHARYA
Kṛṣṇacandra Dāsa – Vṛndāvan: — Shortly after His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Śrīla Prabhupāda entered into his Samādhi līlā in 1977; 11 of his senior disciples and members of the GBC who held the official position of representatives of His Divine Grace in 1st and 2nd spiritual initiations [as per July 9th Document], without authority and without an order by His Divine Grace announced themselves to be pure devotees of the Lord and forcibly seized the titles, roles and functions of acharyas and Initiating Spiritual Masters of ISKCON.
Several months prior to Śrīla Prabhupāda’s departure he signed a document to formalize the initiation process and granted some of his disciples to act on his behalf as representatives in the initiation process for his ISKCON society. This document is known as the July 9th Document.
These 11 disciples’ duty as delineated in the July 9th document, was “to act as ṛtvik representative of the acharya, for the purpose of performing initiations, both first initiation and second initiation” and were given no other ‘special’ duties or entitlements. Following is a breakdown of the specifics contained in the document for ease of reading.
- Now that Śrīla Prabhupāda has named these representatives Temple Presidents may henceforward send recommendations for first and second initiation to whichever of these eleven representatives are nearest their Temple.
- After considering the recommendation, these representatives many accept the devotee as an initiated disciple of Śrīla Prabhupāda by giving a spiritual name, or in the case of a second initiation, by chanting on the Gāyatrī thread just as Śrīla Prabhupāda had done.
- The name of a newly initiated disciple should be sent by the representative who has accepted him or her to Śrīla Prabhupāda, to be included in Divine Grace’s “Initiated Disciples” book.
The role of the Temple President is also included in the July 9th Document:
“After the Temple President receives a letter from these representatives giving the spiritual name or the thread, he can perform the fire yajña in the Temple as was being done before.”
Basically the “representative’s” duty was to act in an official capacity to officially accept, name and record any candidates who were being recommended by the local Temple President for initiation while Śrīla Prabhupāda was not present. The Temple President did the rest. The 9th of July Document did not authorise the “representatives” to do anything else.
How that would translate into practice would be if, say, the ṛtvik representative of Śrīla Prabhupāda was stationed in Vṛndavan while the candidate for initiation was a member of the Delhi Temple. The Delhi TP would send the recommendation to the representative in Vṛndāvan who would give the candidate their name or chant on their Brahmin thread. Once this was done the representative would record their name in the Śrīla Prabhupāda disciple book and the rest including the ceremony would be done by the Temple President. This left Śrīla Prabhupāda free to work on his writing and preaching activities.
The July 9th Document did not authorize them as representatives of Śrīla Prabhupāda; to intervene in the process by removing the role of the Temple President in the initiation process established by Śrīla Prabhupāda and then take the place of the Brahman and preside at the fire yajña to personally initiating the bhakta nor did it give justification for the so called representative to be present in any capacity at the actual initiation yajna – which is unnecessary as Śrīla Prabhupāda will always be ‘present’ at any ceremony conducted under his instructions.
It also did not give them or anyone the right to act as a ṛtvik guru and personally initiate the candidate on behalf of Śrīla Prabhupāda. It merely granted a select number of devotees to act as Śrīla Prabhupāda’s representative in a more or less bureaucratic function in the initiation process.
They were only ṛtvik ‘representatives’ of the Acharya [Śrīla Prabhupāda] for the purpose of initiation, and were never termed as, or considered ṛtvik gurus by Śrīla Prabhupāda. They merely officially represented Śrīla Prabhupāda as he was not able to be in attendance as it was a growing worldwide Society and Śrīla Prabhupāda could not be everywhere at the same time.
There were other statements made by Srila Prabhupada, and his secretary, in the days following the July 9th letter, which clearly indicate that the ritvik system was intended to continue without cessation:
Being a “representative” does not infer that one is a guru in any shape or form of the term. A representative is a person who represents someone else’s policy or purpose or stands in for a person. A representative represents someone for a specific purpose. If a representative is to represent Śrīla Prabhupāda for a TV interview it does not mean that the representative impersonates Śrīla Prabhupāda during or after the interview is over and conducts their affairs as if they were Śrīla Prabhupāda. They represented Śrīla Prabhupāda for a specific purpose, nothing more and nothing less.
The idea that the ṛtvik representative of Śrīla Prabhupāda is a ṛtvik guru and actually initiates devotees on behalf of Śrīla Prabhupāda is a misconception.
If there is no order rescinding this mandate by Śrīla Prabhupāda then one would have to believe that this system was established by Śrīla Prabhupāda to be enacted when he was not physically present to initiate the devotee, and is therefore still applicable. If Śrīla Prabhupāda did in fact intend that this elaborate document be in place for the remaining months he had before he entered into samadhi then he would have given instructions in this very document, but he did not.
The ṛtvik representatives would continue as established by Śrīla Prabhupāda and they would have no actual part in the initiation process other than that stated by the July 9th Document.
Senior men would be appointed by the GBC, as the need arose, to act in the capacity of a ṛtvik representative of Śrīla Prabhupāda, in the initiation process and the Temple Presidents would look after the rest.
This system effectively removes the concern that everyone has, that the representative will impersonate Śrīla Prabhupāda, and start making their own disciples whether they are his ṛtvik disciples or his dīkṣā disciples. There will be no avenue for anyone to be anyone else’s disciple as they would be Śrīla Prabhupāda’s disciples; as per the July 9th Document.
For no matter what – ṛtvik guru or voted in dīkṣā guru – no baddha jīva, who is not on the uttama platform, is able to withstand the allure of worship, fame, power and respect that such an elevated status brings. NO ONE! We have to accept that our duty, our sevā, our role in ISKCON under the auspices of Śrīla Prabhupāda is to act as preachers according to our actual adhikāra.
To this day the GBC, as a body, use their positional power as managers of ISKCON to continue to promote and forcefully support the heretical philosophical deviation that the original 11 usurpers imposed upon Śrīla Prabhupāda’s ISKCON claiming that the role of a dīkṣā guru is open to anyone they deem fit and continues to appoint more and more unqualified, kannistha adhikāra devotees, into the role and function of a dīkṣā guru.
Thus, they have relegated His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Śrīla Prabhupāda as merely the ‘preeminent’ śikṣā guru of ISKCON thus denying his preeminent position as the sole dīkṣā guru of ISKCON. (Per GBC Resolution 1998 404 [Vision and Goal] Definitions of guru and divya jñāna)
Yet the July 9th Document clearly states what the process of initiation should be, when His Divine Grace is not physically present. The only contention would be that the neophyte devotee mistakenly believes that the soul dies when the body dies and that a Vaiṣṇava’s soul can also die and that they are no longer functional in the sense of providing diksa or transcendental knowledge, divya jñāna, as they are dead.
However, being the ‘devotee Bhāgavata’ embodied in his transcendental books which provide both the ‘book Bhāgavata’ and the ‘devotee Bhāgavata’; via Śrīla Prabhupāda’s purports, Śrīla Prabhupāda is always with us and instructing us and similarly Kṛṣṇa is there through the book Bhāgavata. Those with a poor fund of knowledge or who are envious in nature cannot understand these topics.
“There are two types of Bhāgavatas, namely the book Bhāgavata and the devotee Bhāgavata. Both the Bhāgavatas are competent remedies, and both of them or either of them can be good enough to eliminate the obstacles. A devotee Bhāgavata is as good as the book Bhāgavata because the devotee Bhāgavata leads his life in terms of the book Bhāgavata and the book Bhāgavata is full of information about the Personality of Godhead and His pure devotees, who are also Bhāgavatas. Bhāgavata book and person are identical.
The devotee Bhāgavata is a direct representative of Bhagavān, the Personality of Godhead. So by pleasing the devotee Bhāgavata one can receive benefit of the book Bhāgavata.” [Śrīmad Bhāgavatam Canto 1: Chapter Two, Text 18]
So, we can all stop dreaming of being a diksa guru or a ṛtvik guru and allow the pure devotee, the śuddha bhakta, the mahātmā, the paṇḍita, the devotee bhāgavata, the seventh Goswami, the jagat guru and ISKCON’s dīkṣā guru, our parama guru His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Śrīla Prabhupāda be who he is – the divine representative of the Supreme Personality of Godhead Śrī Kṛṣṇa.
We on the other hand “represent” Śrīla Prabhupāda and as such humbly preach the glories of the holy name and do our duty as prescribed by His Divine Grace AC Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda.
All glories to Śrīla Prabhupāda!
Yours in the service of Śrīla Prabhupāda
Kṛṣṇacandra Dāsa
————-
Understanding Srila Prabhupada’s Ritvik Order
By Narasimha das
Many years ago, I was having a discussion with a senior disciple of Srila Prabhupada who had been living aloof from ISKCON for a long time. He was unaware of the reason for the major schism among Srila Prabhupada’s disciples.
I was first trying to explain that everyone in the world should accept Srila Prabhupada as the jagat-guru or the real acharya for all sane people in this age. I politely suggested that His order for the perpetual continuation of ritvik initations in ISKCON was meant to facilitate a united movement for spreading the benediction of Lord Chaitanya’s mission of saving all conditioned souls in this age.
He said, “Well, you seem to have a high realization of Srila Prabhupada, but not all are on that level. Other sincere devotees may not have such grandiose realizations.” I then mentioned that Srila Prabhupada specifically ordered the continuation for ritvik initiations, even after His physical departure. This devotee then tried to suggest that others may have other interpretations of this order according to their own realizations.
I decided not to reply to him further on this topic. I later remembered that even many non-devotees and ordinary people who had contacted Srila Prabhupada immediately recognized, at least for a while, that He was self-effulgent and not at all an ordinary man. Considering this, I wondered why several of His leading disciples lost this understanding as soon as He left this world, or even before.
This discussion often arises:
Why do many of Srila Prabhupada’s direct disciples reject His common-sense order for ritvik initiations? Some devotees suggest it is because–due to familiarity–they had come to see Him as an ordinary man. Others suggest it is because their realizations are not yet mature. Others say it is due to ignorance only. Others say it is due to jealousy or envy. Any or all these things may be true, but I feel the primary reason is given by Srila Prabhupada Himself in the following quotes:
“I have got this personal experience in my Guru Maharaj’s institution. Different Godbrothers took the words of Guru Maharaj in different interpretations for sense gratification and the whole mission [was] disrupted. This is still going on for the last 40 years without any proper settlement. I am always afraid of this crack, but I am sure if our aim is to serve Krishna sincerely and the Spiritual Master simultaneously, that will be our success. That means serve Krishna and the Spiritual Master simultaneously with equal faith and serious vow, and then success is sure. ” (Letter, Oct.18, 1969)
Srila Prabhupada often warned that personal motives among His leading disciples could ruin His mission. Due to personal motives for sense gratification people lose their intelligence by becoming lusty and greedy. There are no limits of sin or selfishness for those possessed by greed and false ambitions. They will commit any abominable action for their depraved ambitions. They may even kill their own children, parents, or spiritual master. This is the verdict of shastra.
For sincere or non-envious devotees, it is easy to conclude that Srila Prabhupada is the real acharya and jagat-guru for the golden age. He is self-effulgent. For devotees not yet pure, yet not envious, this conclusion will be the natural result of careful study without personal ambitions. Such devotees easily understand the beauty and bliss of Srila Prabhupada’s instructions for ritvik initiations.
Some points to consider:
A.) Throughout Srila Prabhupada’s books it is clearly enjoined that only a fully self-realized pure devotee who is specifically appointed by Krishna or the mahabhagavata acharya can become the bona fide spiritual master and impart diksha to new devotees. This was proven by the personal examples of many great devotees, such as Sri Gadadhara Pandit and Srila Gaura Kishora das Babaji, who did not agree to initiate their own disciples without a direct order from Lord Chaitanya or Lord Krishna.
B.) When specifically asked how initiations would be continued after His disappearance, Srila Prabhupada replied, “I shall appoint some of you to act as representatives of the Acharya. Ritvik. Yes.”
C.) Srila Prabhupada gave many follow-up instructions, including an official signed document stating the same thing: ritvik initiations “henceforward.”
D.) The ritvik system was already functioning in ISKCON for many years prior. He simply sanctioned the GBC to manage it without His personal oversight. (Note: “Ritvik” is not a “vada” or philosophy. Rather it is a system of management and sadhana by which priests conduct Vedic rituals under the auspices of the self-realized Acharya.)
E.) Srila Prabhupada repeatedly insisted that nothing in ISKCON management or sadhana be changed.
Srila Prabhupda: “The question may be raised that since the Lord is supposed to be worshiped by great demigods like Lord Brahmā, Lord Śiva and others, how can an ordinary human being on this planet serve Him? This is clearly explained by Pṛithu Mahārāja by the use of the word yathādhikāra, “according to one’s ability.” If one sincerely executes his occupational duty, that will be sufficient. One does not need to become like Lord Brahmā, Lord Śiva, Indra, Lord Chaitanya or Rāmānujācārya, whose capabilities are certainly far above ours. Even a śūdra, who is in the lowest stage of life according to the material qualities, can achieve the same success. Anyone can become successful in devotional service provided he displays no duplicity. It is explained here that one must be very frank and open-minded (amāyinaḥ). To be situated in a lower status of life is not a disqualification for success in devotional service. The only qualification is that whether one is a brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya or śūdra, he must be open, frank and free from reservations.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam : Canto 4: “The Creation of the Fourth Order” : SB 4.21: Instructions by Maharaja Prithu : SB-4.21.33 : PURPORT)
Unfortunately, immediately after Srila Prabhupada’s disappearance in November of 1977, polluted leading members of the GBC made illicit plans for occupying His post, through duplicity and deceit. They avoided conducting “open and frank” discussions with senior Godbrothers conversant with Srila Prabhupada’s books. They “displayed duplicity” by not carefully consulting Srila Prabhupada directly through His books and instructions. They decided instead to go against Srila Prabhupada’s many direct instructions and warnings, for the sake of consulting a Gaudiya Matha sannyasi whom Srila Prabhupada had explained played a major part in the severe disruption of the Gaudiya Matha in 1937.
On the other hand, despite the GBC’s deceit and false propaganda, many sincere new devotees have understood that Srila Prabhupada is the real initiator and teacher for everyone is this age. For them, Srila Prabhupada’s order for the continuation of ritvik initiations is common sense.
“…I have selected you among eleven men as ‘rittvik‘ or representative of the acharya.” (July 10th)
“…the process for initiation to be followed in the future.” (July 11th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my charge.” (July 19th)
“…continue to become ritvik and act on my behalf.” (July 31th)
In these documents we find words such as “continue” and “future” which along with the word “henceforward” all point to the permanancy of the ritvik system. There is no statement from Srila Prabhupada that even hints that this system was to terminate on his departure.
http://www.iskcon-truth.com/official-documents.html
Living Guru misunderstandings cleared up by Srila Prabhupada
Ritvik representative of the acharya
The solution to the ritvik debate
Pamho agtacbsp,thank you to post this serious article on the four regulative principle of liberation from this material pool, actually there are not pure devotees because of this, first come raga dvesa to overcome this enemy is more important than Kama esa krodha esa in sankalpa and vikalpa there is a real story in nilacala dham at time of madvacharya the pujari of Jagannath temple was smoking ganja and madvacharya want to kick them out of the service we be surprised to know that instead of the pujari He got kick out by lord Jagannath by telling him leave these pujaris to do their service I’m happy with their bhakti so a fallen sadhana siddhi can still become a krpa siddhi perfect by the mercy of the lord as happened to that pujari,is not easy at all to understand the thought and action of the lord but if we stay in our natural position without doing the business of someone else we can become krpa siddhi when lord Jesus told to the Jewish priests whoever is without sin throw away the first stone but nobody done that because they were all sinful, at least we are trying to not take birth again then Sri Krishna will see who is fit and who is not so we just keeping to follow the Yuga dharma of Sri harinam sankirtanam ki jai agtacbsp ys haribol
Note: the MANIPULATIVE TRICK of the Anti Ritvik SLAVERY MAKING CON ARTIST BOGUS GURUS was to DUPE the innocent by the word DISCIPLE.
ALL THE -DISCIPLINE- IS FACTUALLY COMING -FROM- SRILA PRABHUPADA -FROM- HIS BOOKS, TAPES,CD’S, MP3’S.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
(by Mahesh Raja)
(SUN) — One who is accepting discipline from Srila Prabhupada is Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. In ISKCON we are ALL being DISCIPLINED by Srila Prabhupada (we receive instructions (DISCIPLINE) FROM Srila Prabhupada’s books. Even the most basic discipline, 16 rounds of Hare Krishna Mantra and four Regulative Principles are coming FROM Srila Prabhupada. Common sense — if you ARE being disciplined BY Srila Prabhupada then it follows you ARE Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. How can it be otherwise?
The MEANING of the word “disciple”
Srila Prabhupada’s Morning Walk, March 8, 1976 in Mayapur:
Prabhupada: “Discipline… Disciple means discipline. The word discipline comes from disciple, or disciple comes from discipline. So unless there is discipline, there is no question of disciple. This discipline must… That should be uniform. Otherwise, sisya… sisya, the word sisya, it comes from the root, verb, sas-dhatu. sas. sas means ruling. From this word, sasana. Sasana means government. sastra. sashtra means weapon, and sastra, scripture, and sisya… These things have come from the one root sas-dhatu. So sas-dhatu means ruling under discipline. There is another English word, that “Obedience is the first law of discipline,” or something. They say, “Obedience is the first law of discipline”? So I am right? “Obedience is…”? That is the…
Tamala Krsna: Yes, that’s more or less what it is.
Prabhupada: No, what is the word, exact. There is an English word. “Obedience is the first law of discipline.” So unless there is obedience, there cannot be any discipline. And unless there is discipline, there is no question of disciple. DISCIPLE MEANS ONE WHO FOLLOWS DISCIPLINE.”
Discipline comes from Srila Prabhupada. We are actually being disciplined by Srila Prabhupada. It is Srila Prabhupada who has given us the regulative principles of no meat, fish or eggs; no intoxication (including tea and coffee), no illicit sex, and no gambling. It is Srila Prabhupada who has made it a regulative principle for us to chant sixteen rounds on the beads HARE KRSNA HARE KRSNA KRSNA KRSNA HARE HARE /HARE RAMA HARE RAMA RAMA RAMA HARE HARE.
Srila Prabhupada’s books contain all the instructions, the guidance required for us to get ourselves out of the clutches of the modes of material nature. In fact, Srila Prabhupada is personally present as his books.
Caitanya-caritamra, Adi 1, Text 35:
“There is NO DIFFERENCE between the spiritual masters instructions and the spiritual master himself.”
Since the instructions of the spiritual master and the spiritual master are not different, one can be the disciple of Srila Prabhupada by following his discipline and can be considered Srila Prabhupada’s disciple. Another point is he can be considered both direct disciple and not direct simultaneously, because Srila Prabhupada is still present in his instruction form (his books). The following example will illustrate the point.
Srila Krsnadasa kaviraja is the example of both direct and not direct disciple simultaneously. (THE PHILOSOPHY OF SIMULTANEOUS ONENESS AND DIFFERENCE).
Caitanya-caritamra, Adi 1:
“A direct disciple of Srila Rupa Gosvami was Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami. The author of Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Srila Krsnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami, stands as the DIRECT DISCIPLE of Srila Rupa Gosvami and Srila Raghunatha dasa Gosvami. The direct disciple of Srila Krsnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami was Srila Narottama dasa Thakura, who accepted Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti as his servitor. Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura accepted Srila Jagannatha dasa Babaji, who initiated Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura, who in turn initiated Srila Gaurakishore dasa Babaji, the spiritual master of Om Visnupada Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Gosvami Maharaja, the divine master of our humble self. Since we belong to this chain of disciplic succession from Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu, this edition of Sri Caitanya-caritamrta will contain nothing newly manufactured by our tiny brains, but only remnants of food originally eaten by the Lord Himself.”
Caitanya-caritamra, Antya 19.102:
Krsnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami was not actually a direct disciple of Srila Rupa Gosvami, but he FOLLOWED THE INSTRUCTIONS given by Srila Rupa Gosvami in Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu. He therefore ACTED ACCORDING TO THE DIRECTIONS of Rupa Gosvami and prayed in every chapter for his mercy.
Who is Srila Prabhupada’s Disciple?
Srila Prabhupada’s Morning Walk, June 13, 1976, Detroit:
Prabhupada: “Who is my disciple? First of all let him FOLLOW STRICTLY THE DISCIPLINED RULES.
Devotee (2): As long as one is following, then he is…
Prabhupada: Then he is all right.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Bhaktijana, September 21, 1972:
“You do not require to worry as I shall never leave you, you are my disciple and I am your spiritual master, so there is no question, AS LONG AS you follow my instructions, that I shall ever leave you. Just remember under all circumstances to chant sixteen rounds of japa daily, offer your prasadam to Krsna, and do all of the things which you already know, as you are senior disciple. These things will protect you under all conditions, without any doubt.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Madhudvisa, November 7, 1975:
“SO LONG AS one follows the principles, he continues to be my disciple.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Tusta Krsna, November 9, 1975:
“SO LONG AS one continues to follow the rules and regulations, he continues to be my disciple wherever he may be.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter, July 9, 1969:
“Out of the ten kinds of offenses, the number one offense is to disobey the orders of the Spiritual Master. The instructions given to the disciple by the Spiritual Master at the time of initiation should be strictly followed. That will make one advance to the spiritual path. But if one deliberately defies such instructions, then his advancement is hampered from the very beginning. THIS DEFYING MEANS TO DISCONNECT THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE SPIRITUAL MASTER. AND ANYONE WHO DEFIES AND THEREFORE DISCONNECTS THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE SPIRITUAL MASTER can hardly expect the assistance of the Spiritual Master life after life.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Cidananda, November 25, 1973:
“Please always try to REMEMBER ME BY MY TEACHINGS AND WE SHALL ALWAYS BE TOGETHER. Just like I have written in the first publications of Srimad-Bhagavatam, “The spiritual Master lives forever by His divine instruction and the disciple lives with him.”, because I have always served my Guru Maharaja and followed His teachings I am now even never separated from Him. Sometimes Maya may come and try to interfere but we must not falter, we must always follow the chalked out path layed down by the great acharya’s and in the end you will see.”
Who is NOT Srila Prabhupada’s disciple?
Initiation does not bear any meaning
Srila Prabhupada Letter, January 11, 1970:
“Regarding your question of an initiated person falling prey to the maya, the answer is that so long we are in this material world, there is always chance of being spoiled by Maya, so we must stick with vow to the Lotus Feet of Krishna. An initiated devotee is given the chance for becoming free from the entanglement of karma wheel. Initiated means beginning, not perfection. The Spiritual Master’s business is to guide him to the perfectional point. But if one does not strictly follow the guidance of a bonafide Spiritual Master HIS INITIATION DOES NOT BEAR ANY MEANING. The initiation performance is an agreement by the disciples to abide by the order of the Spiritual Master. Therefore, if the Spiritual Master is bonafide and the disciple is serious to abide by His order, then the success is sure.”
Otherwise they are NOT my disciples
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Raja Laksmi, February 17, 1976:
“My advise is always chant 16 rounds minimum and follow the four regulative principles. All of my disciples must agree on this point OTHERWISE THEY ARE NOT MY DISCIPLES.”
Against the principle
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Dhrstaketu, July 17, 1976:
“Unless absolutely necessary, one should keep head shaven and not allow the hair to grow long. If absolutely necessary, one can dress like an American gentleman, with short hair, but long hair is prohibited. The reason that one with long hair is not my disciple is because he is AGAINST THE PRINCIPLE. Unless absolutely necessary one should keep hair short, and if necessary one can dress like an American gentleman with short hair. It is not expected that everyone will join. For that reason we can’t compromise. The tendency is there to be hippy. When the acaryas are seen with beard, that is during Caturmasya, July-September. If observed strictly there is not simply a beard. There are so many rules and regulations. One can’t eat a variety of foods. Only kitri prepared and poured on the floor, and then licked up. There are so many other rules also. THAT IS NOT ALWAYS THAT THEY KEPT BEARD.”
There are many so-called Prabhupada disciples – but only in name. They in fact decline to follow Srila Prabhupada’s discipline hence they are Srila Prabhupada disciples in name only. They show superficial lip service to Srila Prabhupada.
Disciple in name only
Srila Prabhupada Morning Walk, New York, July 10, 1976:
Prabhupada: And the Bon Maharaja is his follower. HE’S IN NAME a disciple of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati, BUT HE’S A SERVANT OF Vivekananda.
Tamala Krsna: He’s very similar to him.
Prabhupada: He’s a great appreciator of Vivekananda. He has put in his curriculum Vivekananda philosophy, Gandhi philosophy. Rascal, what philosophy they have got?
STEALING SRILA PRABHUPADA’S DISCIPLES, HIS PROPERTIES, FOR ONESELF (BECOMING SELF MADE GURU-BY BOGUS GBC APPOINTMENT OF 2/3 MAJORITY VOTES) HAS GRAVE CONSEQUENCES:
Krsna Book, Chapter 64 – The Story of King Nrga:
At this time, Lord Krsna was present among His relatives who were members of the ksatriya class. To teach them through the exemplary character of King Nrga, He said, “Even though a ksatriya king may be as powerful as fire, it is not possible for him to usurp the property of a brahmana and utilize it for his own purpose. If this is so, how can ordinary kings, who falsely think of themselves as the most powerful beings within the material world, usurp a brahmana’s property? I do not think that taking poison is as dangerous as taking a brahmana’s property. For ordinary poison there is treatment–one can be relieved from its effects; but if one drinks the poison of taking a brahmana’s property, there is no remedy for the mistake. THE PERFECT EXAMPLE IS KING NRGA. HE WAS VERY POWERFUL AND VERY PIOUS, BUT DUE TO THE SMALL MISTAKE OF UNKNOWINGLY USURPING A BRAHMANA’S COW, HE WAS CONDEMNED TO THE ABOMINABLE LIFE OF A LIZARD. Ordinary poison affects only those who drink it, and ordinary fire can be extinguished simply by pouring water on it; BUT THE ARANI FIRE IGNITED BY THE SPIRITUAL POTENCY OF A BRAHMANA CAN BURN TO ASHES THE WHOLE FAMILY OF A PERSON WHO PROVOKES SUCH A BRAHMANA.” (Formerly, the brahmanas used to ignite the fire of sacrifice not with matches or any other external fire but with their powerful mantras, called arani.) “IF SOMEONE EVEN TOUCHES A BRAHMANA’S PROPERTY, HE IS RUINED FOR THREE GENERATIONS. HOWEVER, IF A BRAHMANA’S PROPERTY IS FORCIBLY TAKEN AWAY, THE TAKER’S FAMILY FOR TEN GENERATIONS BEFORE HIM AND TEN GENERATIONS AFTER HIM WILL BECOME SUBJECT TO RUINATION. On the other hand, if someone becomes a Vaisnava, or devotee of the Lord, ten generations of his family before his birth and ten generations after will become liberated.”
Lord Krsna continued: “If some foolish king who is puffed up by his wealth, prestige and power wants to usurp a brahmana’s property, it should be understood that such a king is clearing his path to hell; he does not know how much he has to suffer for such unwise action. If someone takes away the property of a very liberal brahmana who is encumbered by a large dependent family, then such a usurper is put into the hell known as Kumbhipaka; not only is he put into this hell, but his family members also have to accept such a miserable condition of life. A PERSON WHO TAKES AWAY PROPERTY WHICH HAS EITHER BEEN AWARDED TO A BRAHMANA OR GIVEN AWAY BY HIM IS CONDEMNED TO LIVE FOR AT LEAST 60,000 YEARS AS MISERABLY AS AN INSECT IN STOOL. THEREFORE I INSTRUCT YOU, ALL MY BOYS AND RELATIVES PRESENT HERE, DO NOT, EVEN BY MISTAKE, TAKE THE POSSESSION OF A BRAHMANA AND THEREBY POLLUTE YOUR WHOLE FAMILY. IF SOMEONE EVEN WISHES TO POSSESS SUCH PROPERTY, LET ALONE ATTEMPTS TO TAKE IT AWAY BY FORCE, THE DURATION OF HIS LIFE WILL BE REDUCED. HE WILL BE DEFEATED BY HIS ENEMIES, AND AFTER BEING BEREFT OF HIS ROYAL POSITION, WHEN HE GIVES UP HIS BODY HE WILL BECOME A SERPENT. A SERPENT GIVES TROUBLE TO ALL OTHER LIVING ENTITIES. My dear boys and relatives, I therefore advise you that even if a brahmana becomes angry with you and calls you by ill names or curses you, still you should not retaliate. On the contrary, you should smile, tolerate him and offer your respects to the brahmana. You know very well that even I Myself offer My obeisances to the brahmanas with great respect three times daily. You should therefore follow My instruction and example. I shall not forgive anyone who does not follow them, and I shall punish him. You should learn from the example of King Nrga that even if someone unknowingly usurps the property of a brahmana, he is put into a miserable condition of life.”
It has been a common practice among Srila Prabhupada’s Godbrothers to steal Srila Prabhupada’s disciples by trickery. Sridhara Maharaja and Puri Maharaja are also known to have re-initiated Srila Prabhupada’s disciples. Narayana Maharaja is also a culprit in this deplorable un-Vaisnava, offensive, insulting conduct. This act proves they are conditioned souls.
From the letter below one can see that history repeats itself; because they are conditioned souls they ventured to initiate Srila Prabhupada’s disciples. Thus, they were caught out as Srila Prabhupada clearly says of the action: “SO IT IS DELIBERATE TRANSGRESSION OF VAISNAVA ETIQUETTES AND OTHERWISE A DELIBERATE INSULT TO ME. I DO NOT KNOW WHY HE HAS DONE LIKE THIS BUT NO VAISNAVA WILL APPROVE OF THIS OFFENSIVE ACTION.”
Srila Prabhupada Letter to Mukunda, March 26, 1968:
“In meantime, I have also received one letter which is very depressing from Hrsikesa. I understand that he has been induced by Bon Maharaja to be initiated by him for giving him shelter, and this foolish boy has accepted his inducement. This isn’t very happy news, and I have replied Hrsikesa’s letter in the following words, which please take note, and in the future, we shall be very cautious about them. “My Dear Hrsikesa, Please accept my blessings. I am in due receipt of your letter of March 14, 1968, and I am greatly surprised. I AM GREATLY SURPRISED FOR BON MAHARAJA’S INITIATING YOU IN SPITE OF HIS KNOWING THAT YOU ARE ALREADY INITIATED BY ME. SO IT IS DELIBERATE TRANSGRESSION OF VAISNAVA ETIQUETTES AND OTHERWISE A DELIBERATE INSULT TO ME. I DO NOT KNOW WHY HE HAS DONE LIKE THIS BUT NO VAISNAVA WILL APPROVE OF THIS OFFENSIVE ACTION. I very much appreciate your acknowledgement of my service unto you and you will always have my blessings, BUT YOU MUST KNOW THAT YOU HAVE COMMITTEE. A GREAT BLUNDER. I do not wish to discuss on this point more elaborately now, but if you are desirous to know further about it, I shall be glad to give you more enlightenment. Mukunda is not here. He has gone to L.A. Hope you are well.” If Hrsikesa writes you letter I think you may avoid reply. I DO NOT APPROVE BOTH HRSIKESA’S AND BON MAHARAJA’S THIS OFFENSIVE ACTION. Hoping you are both well.”
In venturing to initiate Srila Prabhupada’s disciples —they could not even have understood the philosophy properly. As It is clearly stated: A DEVOTEE MUST HAVE ONLY ONE INITIATING SPIRITUAL MASTER BECAUSE IN THE SCRIPTURES ACCEPTANCE OF MORE THAN ONE IS ALWAYS FORBIDDEN. For them to Initiate Srila Prabhupada’s disciples they would be falling into a trap of REJECTING Srila Prabhupada as the Initiating Guru—DIRECT INSULT-committed BOTH by the so-called disciple of Srila Prabhupada and their conditioned soul “gurus”.
Caitanya-caritamra, Adi 1.35:
The Spiritual Masters
“The expert spiritual master knows well how to engage his disciple’s energy in the transcendental loving service of the Lord, and thus he engages a devotee in a specific devotional service according to his special tendency. A DEVOTEE MUST HAVE ONLY ONE INITIATING SPIRITUAL MASTER BECAUSE IN THE SCRIPTURES ACCEPTANCE OF MORE THAN ONE IS ALWAYS FORBIDDEN.”
ALL GLORIES TO OUR BONAFIDE JAGAT DIKSA
AND SIKSA GURU SRILA PRABHUPADA!
HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE
HARE RAMA HARE RAMA RAMA RAMA HARE HARE
http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=43453
Note: Anti Ritvik CROOKS (those who are against Srila Prabhupada THE Diksa Guru and his ORDER July 9th 1977 Ritvik System) are DEFEATED:
NoD 8 Offenses to Be Avoided
The offenses against the chanting of the holy name are as follows: (3) To disobey the orders of the spiritual master.
Madhya 24.330 The Sixty-One Explanations of the Atmarama Verse
MAHA-BHAGAVATA-srestho
brahmano vai gurur nrnam
sarvesam eva lokanam
asau pujyo yatha harih
maha-kula-prasuto ‘pi
sarva-yajnesu DIKSITAH
sahasra-sakhadhyayi ca
na guruh syad avaisnavah
((The guru MUST be situated on the topmost platform of devotional service. There are three classes of devotees, and the guru MUST be accepted from the topmost class. The first-class devotee is the spiritual master for all kinds of people. ….When one has attained the topmost position of MAHA-BHAGAVATA, he is to be accepted as a guru and worshiped exactly like Hari, the Personality of Godhead. ONLY SUCH A PERSON IS ELIGIBLE TO OCCUPY THE POST OF A GURU.))
Note: The word DIKSITAH refers to Diksa and ONLY Maha Bhagavata is the one mentioned WHO give this BY DEFINITION.
75-08-04. Letter: Madhudvisa:
The GBC should all be the instructor gurus. I AM IN THE INITIATOR GURU, and you should be the instructor guru by teaching what I am teaching and doing what I am doing. This is not a title, but you must actually come to this platform. This I want.
“I AM THE SPIRITUAL MASTER OF THIS INSTITUTION, AND ALL THE MEMBERS OF THE SOCIETY, THEY’RE SUPPOSED TO BE MY DISCIPLES. They follow the rules and regulations which I ask them to follow, AND THEY ARE INITIATED BY ME SPIRITUALLY.”(Srila Prabhupada Radio Interview, 12/3/1968)
“Guru-mukha-padma-vakya, cittete koriya aikya, ara na koriho mane asa. Don’t think of any nonsense. Simply execute what your guru has said. That is success.”
(28th January, 1977, Room Conversation)
Srila Prabhupada did not come to the west and travel the whole world just for those who are devotees and followers at this present time in history. Nope. When Srila Prabhupada said “So if you are able to follow these principles without fail, then you are as good as my disciple.” he was speaking to every man, woman and child at that time and well into the future to the end of Lord Caitanya’s Golden Age. We have again ignored this very simple and easy to understand instruction so let us allow Srila Prabhupada to have this message speak for itself.
To have to reference anything from the so-called GBC and so called ISKCON or even the so called BBT regarding this topic is to confuse present and future generations by misdirecting them to consider that the so-called GBC, ISKCON and BBT have any credibility now or in the future. They are irrelevant. Let that sink in deep and long. This posting is not supposed to be a test of scriptural intellect at the expense of those seeking greatly needed shelter. It is supposed to be a message of hope to support those that we are supposed to be assisting right now. So, have some empathy and allow the suffering masses to enjoy this invitation and encouragement from Srila Prabhupada to take shelter of him while you continue your preaching and teaching. That is the goal.
Become Fully Jolly
Out on sankirtan with potatoes and rice,
Stashed in my book bag right next to the Gita,
The long day to serve will be worth the price,
For service to Krsna nothing is sweet’a.
I may be retired from the bus fuss and chime,
I recharged my heart then jumped on the trolly,
To serve Srila Prabhupada for the rest of my time,
And as sure as he promised I’m now fully jolly.
Hasti Gopala Dasa April 13 2010
Note: when these Anti Ritvik CROOKS decide to USURP Srila Prabhupada’s Diksa Guru position Lord Krishna lets them do their nefarious acts of spiritual master business for sense gratification, so that they can be punished: THE LORD ENGAGES HIM IN IMPIOUS ACTIVITIES SO HE MAY GO TO HELL.
eṣa u hy eva sādhu karma kārayati taṁ yamebhyo lokebhya unninīṣate
eṣa u evāsādhu karma kārayati yamadho ninīṣate.
ajño jantur anīso ‘yam ātmanaḥ sukha-duḥkhayoḥ
īśvara-prerito gacchet svargaṁ vāśvabhram eva ca.
“THE LORD ENGAGES THE LIVING ENTITY IN PIOUS ACTIVITIES SO HE MAY BE ELEVATED. THE LORD ENGAGES HIM IN IMPIOUS ACTIVITIES SO HE MAY GO TO HELL. The living entity is completely dependant in his distress and happiness. BY THE WILL OF THE SUPREME HE CAN GO TO HEAVEN OR HELL, AS A CLOUD IS DRIVEN BY THE AIR.”
Therefore the embodied soul, by his immemorial desire to avoid Kṛṣṇa consciousness, causes his own bewilderment. Consequently, although he is constitutionally eternal, blissful and cognizant, due to the littleness of his existence he forgets his constitutional position of service to the Lord and is thus entrapped by nescience. And, under the spell of ignorance, the living entity claims that the Lord is responsible for his conditional existence. The Vedānta-sūtras also confirm this:
vaiṣamya-nairghṛṇye na sāpekṣatvāt tathā hi darśayati.
“The Lord neither hates nor likes anyone, though He appears to.”
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/bg/5/15
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SB 6.7.14 Indra Offends His Spiritual Master, Brhaspati.
A stone boat would be unable to float and would sink in the water with its passengers. SIMILARLY, THOSE WHO MISLEAD PEOPLE GO TO HELL, AND THEIR FOLLOWERS GO WITH THEM.
72-12-14. Letter: Tusta Krsna
As for your next question, can only a few pure devotees deliver others, anyone, if he is a pure devotee he can deliver others, he can become spiritual master. But unless he on that platform he should not attempt it. THEN BOTH OF THEM WILL TO GO TO HELL, LIKE BLIND MEN LEADING THE BLIND.
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SRI ISOPANISAD CONFIRMS THAT THESE PSEUDO RELIGIONISTS ARE HEADING TOWARD THE MOST OBNOXIOUS PLACE IN THE UNIVERSE AFTER THE COMPLETION OF THEIR SPIRITUAL MASTER BUSINESS, WHICH THEY CONDUCT SIMPLY FOR SENSE GRATIFICATION.
Isopanisad 12
The Lord states that as soon as one reaches Him by devotional service–which is the one and only way to approach the Personality of Godhead–one attains complete freedom from the bondage of birth and death. In other words, the path of salvation from the material clutches fully depends on the principles of knowledge and detachment gained from serving the Lord. The pseudo religionists have neither knowledge nor detachment from material affairs, for most of them want to live in the golden shackles of material bondage under the shadow of philanthropic activities disguised as religious principles. BY A FALSE DISPLAY OF RELIGIOUS SENTIMENTS, THEY PRESENT A SHOW OF DEVOTIONAL SERVICE WHILE INDULGING IN ALL SORTS OF IMMORAL ACTIVITIES. IN THIS WAY THEY PASS AS SPIRITUAL MASTERS AND DEVOTEES OF GOD. Such violators of religious principles have no respect for the authoritative acaryas, the holy teachers in the strict disciplic succession. THEY IGNORE THE VEDIC INJUNCTION ACARYOPASANA–“ONE MUST WORSHIP THE ACARYA”–and Krsna’s statement in the Bhagavad-gita (4.2) evam parampara-praptam, “This supreme science of God is received through the disciplic succession.” INSTEAD, TO MISLEAD THE PEOPLE IN GENERAL THEY THEMSELVES BECOME SO-CALLED ACARYAS, BUT THEY DO NOT EVEN FOLLOW THE PRINCIPLES OF THE ACARYAS.
THESE ROGUES ARE THE MOST DANGEROUS ELEMENTS IN HUMAN SOCIETY. BECAUSE THERE IS NO RELIGIOUS GOVERNMENT, THEY ESCAPE PUNISHMENT BY THE LAW OF THE STATE. THEY CANNOT, HOWEVER, ESCAPE THE LAW OF THE SUPREME, WHO HAS CLEARLY DECLARED IN THE BHAGAVAD-GITA THAT ENVIOUS DEMONS IN THE GARB OF RELIGIOUS PROPAGANDISTS SHALL BE THROWN INTO THE DARKEST REGIONS OF HELL (BG. 16.19-20). SRI ISOPANISAD CONFIRMS THAT THESE PSEUDO RELIGIONISTS ARE HEADING TOWARD THE MOST OBNOXIOUS PLACE IN THE UNIVERSE AFTER THE COMPLETION OF THEIR SPIRITUAL MASTER BUSINESS, WHICH THEY CONDUCT SIMPLY FOR SENSE GRATIFICATION.
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Note: many times these Anti Ritvik crooks COVER-UP so as to put themselves on good image to fool the public how their lot die but here is how reports tell us otherwise:
1) Tamal Krishna – pictures show his head bandaged and covered – this was result of his head crashing through the windscreen in the car accident – crowned in glass. Can anyone imagine of the pain that must have been????
They have his carcass “samadhi” for worship????? go figure that.
2) Bhakti caru – he was transported to a Florida expensive treatment hospital. He was put on VENTILATOR – what does this tell us of his painful exit? Carcass returned to India.
3) Suhotra swami found dead in TOILET in Mayapur. Nice place to go?????
4) Gopi Pranadhana who with Hridayananda dasa manipulated Srimad Bhagavatam final edition was found dead in Vrindavan in—– THE TOILET—- the DOOR WAS—– LOCKED FROM INSIDE. So—- what does this tell us????
The Case for Blind Uttama Adhikaris
http://harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/06-10/editorials6158.htm
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Of course, later on—– they change/fabricate stories to dupe the public —- BUT —- there ARE people— WHO DO—– get to know the TRUTH of—– exactly—- HOW they died.
“You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time.”
“We request you to chant HARE KRISHNA HARE KRISHNA, KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE, HARE RAMA HARE RAMA, RAMA RAMA HARE HARE, and your life will be sublime.”
This is the perfect illustration of the present interregnum within much of the Hare Krsna movement. The diffusion of responsibility is now fully ingrained and wide spread. No one and I mean no one is willing to take action because they feel that the others will do it. That is the bystander effect. If one is clever enough one can certainly convince themselves that because they are repeating truths they have no responsibility to actually act on those truths. Or even give others practical advice on how to do so.
Pamho agtacbsp, srila isvara Puri tirobhava mahotsava ki jai, although HG Mahesh Raj explain nicely the iskcon history regarding the spiritual robbery of our beloved spiritual master but their tiny brains can’t understand it until they found themselves in the hell including their false guru, it’s sad to see our spiritual movement still under siege by mleccha without any vaisnava background history anyway everything is under the control of Sri Krishna bhagavat agtacbsp ys haribol
Note: these Anti Ritvik CROOKS have got now Tamal Krsna carcass in TOMB and they worship this. This is all TAMASIC guna. They are -actually- in the mode of DARKNESS (ignorance):
TEXT 4
yajante sāttvikā devān
yakṣa-rakṣāṁsi rājasāḥ
pretān bhūta-gaṇāṁś cānye
yajante tāmasā janāḥ
SYNONYMS
yajante—worship; sāttvikāḥ—those who are in the mode of goodness; devān—demigods; yakṣa-rakṣāṁsi rājasāḥ—those who are in the mode of passion worship demons; pretān—dead spirits; bhūta-gaṇān—ghosts; ca anye—and others; yajante—worship; tāmasāḥ—in the mode of ignorance; janāḥ—people.
TRANSLATION
Men in the mode of goodness worship the demigods; those in the mode of passion worship the demons; AND THOSE IN THE MODE OF IGNORANCE WORSHIP GHOSTS AND SPIRITS.
PURPORT
In this verse the Supreme Personality of Godhead describes different kinds of worshipers according to their external activities. According to scriptural injunction, only the Supreme Personality of Godhead is worshipable, but those who are not very conversant with, or faithful to, the scriptural injunctions worship different objects, according to their specific situations in the modes of material nature. Those who are situated in goodness generally worship the demigods. The demigods include Brahmā, Śiva and others such as Indra, Candra and the sun-god. There are various demigods. Those in goodness worship a particular demigod for a particular purpose. Similarly, those who are in the mode of passion worship the demons. We recall that during the Second World War, a man in Calcutta worshiped Hitler because thanks to that war he had amassed a large amount of wealth by dealing in the black market. Similarly, those in the modes of passion and ignorance generally select a powerful man to be God. They think that anyone can be worshiped as God and that the same results will be obtained.
Now, it is clearly described here that those who are in the mode of passion worship and create such gods, AND THOSE WHO ARE IN THE MODE OF IGNORANCE, IN DARKNESS, WORSHIP DEAD SPIRITS. SOMETIMES PEOPLE WORSHIP AT THE TOMB OF SOME DEAD MAN. Sexual service is also considered to be in the mode of darkness. Similarly, in remote villages in India there are worshipers of ghosts. We have seen that in India the lower class people sometimes go to the forest, and if they have knowledge that a ghost lives in a tree, they worship that tree and offer sacrifices. These different kinds of worship are not actually God worship. God worship is for persons who are transcendentally situated in pure goodness. In the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam it is said, sattvaṁ viśuddham vāsudeva-śabditam. “When a man is situated in pure goodness, he worships Vāsudeva.” The purport is that those who are completely purified of the material modes of nature and who are transcendentally situated can worship the Supreme Personality of Godhead.
The impersonalists are supposed to be situated in the mode of goodness, and they worship five kinds of demigods. They worship the impersonal Viṣṇu, or Viṣṇu form in the material world, which is known as philosophized Viṣṇu. Viṣṇu is the expansion of the Supreme Personality of Godhead, but the impersonalists, because they do not ultimately believe in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, imagine that the Viṣṇu form is just another aspect of the impersonal Brahman; similarly, they imagine that Lord Brahmā is the impersonal form in the material mode of passion. Thus they sometimes describe five kinds of gods that are worshipable, but because they think that the actual truth is impersonal Brahman, they dispose of all worshipable objects at the ultimate end. In conclusion, the different qualities of the material modes of nature can be purified through association with persons who are of transcendental nature.
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/bg/17/4
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Prabhupāda: That religiosity also different kinds: rajasic, tamasic, and sattvic, according to one’s nature. The sattvic, they worship Viṣṇu. The rajasic, they worship the demigods. AND THE TAMASIC, THEY WORSHIP BHŪTA, PRETA, PIŚĀCA…
Devotee: Demons.
Prabhupāda: Demons. You’ll see the Mohammedans, they worship the tomb. And Christian also, they worship the tomb. They offer wreath on the tomb. SO TAMASIC. WHAT IS THERE IN THE TOMB? BUT BECAUSE THEY’RE TAMASIC, THEY’RE WORSHIPING LIKE THAT.
Link to this page: https://prabhupadabooks.com/conversations/1974/apr/morning_walk/bombay/april/08/1974
Virtually no-one is able to follow this prescription. We are all so fallen. None of us can follow His Divine Grace’s instructions to the letter.
1. If you are over 50 years old and still sleeping in your wife’s bed, you are not following instruction. Re do not lecture me ie vanaprasta grihasta blah blah
2. _ _ _ (please fill in as you see fit)
Ys Cigarette Sam.
So many bogus gurus, so many fake renunciates.
Fringie: an often Krishna conscious person who openly disobeys the order to oserve the four regulative principles but nevertheless takes part in the movement but declines the persuasion to join ISKCON;
Devotee: an often Krishna conscious person who secretly disobeys the four regulaive principles but maintains their appearance to look like an ISKCON devotee and continues the charade so as to fully aid the movement;
ISKCON Guru: an often Krishna conscious person who…. fill in the rest…
All of the above and more.
I am a fringie and proud of it!
Although I gave up smoking long ago I still use the moniker as that may aid in older Melbourne devotees identify me. I was always ducking out the back for a ciggie. My loss, as they chorused harmoniously. That was way back inthe 70s and 80s.