Prof. Hopkins, July 13, 1975, Philadelphia: I’m not thinking so much of the specific Cantos as the Srimad-Bhagavatam as a whole. Is that, for you, as you see it, more important than Bhagavad-gita?
Prabhupada: No, Bhagavad-gita is the preliminary study of Srimad- Bhagavatam.
Prof. Hopkins: So you would see the two related to each other.
Prabhupada: Yes. If one can understand Bhagavad-gita then he becomes a bona fide student of Srimad-Bhagavatam.
Prof. Hopkins: Oh.
Prabhupada: Because in the… You have read Bhagavad-gita?
Prof. Hopkins: Oh yes, I have.
Prabhupada: So Bhagavad-gita, last instruction is sarva dharman parityajya mam ekam saranam vraja. [Bg. 18.66] “You give up all kinds of occupation and just surrender unto Me.” If one can take it very seriously, understand, then he can enter into the study of Bhagavatam. The Bhagavatam begins from the point where Krishna left Bhagavad-gita. So he advised that “You surrender to Me,” and Bhagavata begins, satyam param dhimahi, “I am worshiping the Supreme Truth.” And next verse is dharmah projjhita-kaitavo ’tra [SB 1.1.2], “All cheating type of religious system is rejected.” So this is rather revolting. Krishna says sarva dharman parityajya [Bg. 18.66], “Give up all kinds of religious system, just surrender to Me.” And from that point Bhagavata begins, “All cheating type of religious system is rejected.” It is meant for the paramahamsa. Paramo nirmatsaranam. Those who are envious, for them is not Bhagavata. So any materialistic person, he is envious. It is not meant for the materialistic person. Those who are spiritually advanced, one who has understood that “I am not this body, I am spirit soul, my direct connection is with God, therefore my only business is to serve God.” One who has come to this conclusion, he is called paramahamsa. Hamsa means swan. A swan, it has got a quality that if you give the swan to drink milk mixed with water, she will drink the milk and reject the water. She has got the capacity. So paramahamsa means one who has taken the essence of the existence, Absolute Truth, he is called paramahamsa.
Prof. Hopkins: So you would see the Bhagavad-gita then as accessible to a wide range of people, at an elementary level or beginning level, whereas Srimad-Bhagavatam would be for more advanced, more advanced people.
Prabhupada: Not only advanced, completely advanced. Because so long one will be, stay on the material platform, he will be envious of others only, animal propensity, dog. Dog does not like another dog is coming. So unless one is spiritually realized, the dog mentality will remain there. It is said nasau munir yasya matam na bhinnam, even amongst the topmost thinkers, if he does not refute other thinkers, he is not a good thinker. That enviousness. He will not be established a good thinker if he cannot… If a scientist, if he cannot refute the previous scientist, he is not a scientist. This is material world. Everyone is envious of the other. So Bhagavata meant for who is no more envious. Simply loving.
Prof. Hopkins: Why, why is that more necessary for Srimad- Bhagavatam than for Bhagavad-gita?
Prabhupada: More… Bhagavatam, I told you, it is a counterpart. Just like when you have passed the school examination then next you admit yourself for degree or graduate degree. Similarly, Bhagavata is the end of education. Everyone is progressing. When one comes to Srimad-Bhagavatam and understands it then his education is complete.
Prof. Hopkins: Then would it be, would it be dangerous for someone who is not at that level to study Srimad-Bhagavatam or would they simply not understand it?
Prabhupada: Dangerous means if one is not completely educated of self-realization he has the risk of degradation.
Prof. Hopkins: He has what?
Prabhupada: The risk of degradation. Now I have got human form of body, I may degrade to animal. Because transmigration of the soul. In the Bhagavad-gita it is said, tatha dehantara praptir, after death one gets another body. Now, what kind of body, that depends on his work. Urdhvam gacchanti sattva-sthah. If he has done very nicely, in goodness, then he will be promoted to the higher planetary system. And if he has not done anything nice then he will remain here or he will be degraded to the lower planetary system.
Prof. Hopkins: That is… How does that relate to the question of studying the Srimad-Bhagavatam?
Prabhupada: Srimad-Bhagavatam or Bhagavad-gita, if one realizes properly then he gets promotion back to home, back to Godhead. He is no more a person to live in this material world. Material world means ups and down, ups and down. And spiritual world means steady life of knowledge and bliss.
Prof. Hopkins: But if one were to study, read Srimad-Bhagavatam who was not ready for this, not prepared for it, this might throw them into confusion then, or this would be…
Prabhupada: No.
Prof. Hopkins: Would it be bad for them or would they simply not learn from it.
Prabhupada: No, as I told you the… Our only business is to know the Absolute Truth. If you do not try for this then you remain animals. Animal cannot know the Absolute Truth. So to remain animal means varieties of life. Sometimes cat, sometimes dog, sometimes demigod, sometimes this, sometimes that, sometimes American, sometimes something else. This will go on. Bhutva bhutva praliyate. In this life we are living, we are making the next body. So if we work nicely then next body may be the higher planetary system or above this material world, in the spiritual world.
Prof. Hopkins: And the way to progress then is to take, to study, to learn these things in order, in the proper order.
Prabhupada: Yes.
Prof. Hopkins: I remember when I first, when I first met Brahmananda in New York. I came there initially in part to, because I had been studying Bhagavatam and I wanted to talk to people in the temple about Srimad-Bhagavatam. And they said, “What is this?” (laughs) “We’ve heard Swamiji speak of this but we don’t know it.” A few years later you were all sitting around reciting verses from Srimad-Bhagavatam. Was this… You did not begin to teach Srimad- Bhagavatam when you first came to the U.S.
Prabhupada: No, I taught Bhagavad-gita first of all, then Bhagavata.
Prof. Hopkins: So you prepared, you prepared them with…
Prabhupada: Oh yes.
Prof. Hopkins: Bhagavad-gita and then Srimad-Bhagavatam.
Prabhupada: You have seen yesterday’s procession?
Prof. Hopkins: I didn’t get to the one yesterday, no.
Prabhupada: So, unless we have prepared groundwork, it is not possible.
Prof. Hopkins: A related question, which is a practical question also. I am collecting material for a kind of sourcebook, readings in Hinduism, contemporary as well as classical, and would like to include in these readings some of the things that you have written. Of the things that you have written what do you consider most important?
Prabhupada: Prema pumartho mahan: The most important thing is how to love God.
Full Conversation: http://prabhupadabooks.com/conversations/1975/jul/conversation_with_professor_hopkins/philadelphia/july/13/1975
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